|
Post by theropod on Apr 28, 2020 23:40:21 GMT 5
I disagree with the notion that calling Trump stupid constitutes an insult, I take this to be a statement of fact*. The man thought Belgium was a city.
Anyway I did not intend this to become a drawn-out discussion, I rather took my original statement to be fairly uncontroversial, seeing how it apparently required clarification, I have elaborated on it in the original post, including the direct quotes showing what Trump did say. On my account there is nothing left to discuss, so I won’t continue the discussion unless there is a drastic change of tone and content. We can gladly discuss the evidence for or against the efficacy (and yes, it was efficacy!) of Chloroquine and/or Hydroxychloroquine, which is not a political topic at all and should not be confused with one, but if @ceratodromeus wants an actual political argument with me, then he can gladly have it in the appropriate section.
*Meaning it cannot be an insult, since it is true. At least this is the legal situation in my country. The US doesn’t actually criminalise insults afaik so I don’t know if there’s any differing legal definition for what an insult is or isn’t.
|
|
|
Post by elosha11 on Apr 28, 2020 23:55:21 GMT 5
theropod, I was referring to you both insulting each other, not Trump or any other politician. FYI, insults are not actionable defamation in the U.S., nor are true statements. Anyone can insult any politician, as long as it is not obscene and does not instigate a clear and present danger towards violence. Criticism and insulting political figures is an inherent right of free speech under our Constitution.
|
|
|
Post by theropod on Apr 29, 2020 0:33:37 GMT 5
Well I don’t think I have insulted ceratodromeus, he merely chose to feel insulted by a number of criteria for whom I consider stupid (mainly "people who get their medical advice from Donald Trump", which is another thing I would say is a very objective criterium for stupidity, considering it can literally be fatal), but I don’t think it is my fault if he chooses to identify with any of these criteria. In fact I think he has been very careful to not make any statement that could be called an insult towards me either, which obviously with him being so critical of my (true, hence non-insulting) ad hominem towards Trump would have come across as a double standard. Though I think he has made a fair deal of unwarranted and yes, lazy criticisms of my argumentation that I have already addressed, I do not consider those to be the same thing as insults, as they are not directed at a person but just at argumentation.
|
|
|
Post by elosha11 on Apr 29, 2020 0:40:29 GMT 5
Fair enough. I guess my point was overall more related to sarcasm than to literal insults. The line is blurry sometimes.
|
|
|
Post by theropod on Apr 29, 2020 1:05:34 GMT 5
Hmm yes I would also have appreciated less of that, but there is a certain difficulty in voicing an entirely non-sarcastic response to an entirely sarcastic post.
|
|
|
Post by Ceratodromeus on Apr 29, 2020 2:37:50 GMT 5
Why am i "insulted"? Because i have chosen to not call people stupid, and called out the fact that you have? Is that insulted behavior? This kind of comment is as bafflingly odd as your insinuation that i was attacking your english.
I haven't insulted him once, so i'm not sure where you're getting that from. All of my comments have been directed at how he has constructed his argument.
Anyway,
You can try and distance yourself from the claim(s) that - I didn't read my own source(Lol) - This kind of quote is anything more than dubious
all you want, but the fact remains, and as i strongly said, if it isn't something that is independently verifiable, you shouldn't use it as a proponent of your argument. Regardless of your personal beliefs, one would have figured that is a basic argument structure thing. Guess not.
So, saying that you haven't claimed he said something in your reply, and then in your next reply using the gross interpretation
Once again, if you don't think the two quotes from your argument directly contradict the one on the bottom, that is a cognitively dissonant.
Lol, it makes perfect sense. You just chose to ignore it, for your own fallacious reasons. His verbatim quote of "can we do something like that" definitely refers to a different product, not just straight disinfectant. You can play the game of fallacy, going for "it made no sense so i ignored it"
And well see, this quote from you perfectly demonstrates that you were capable of interpreting it correctly. You just chose to sprinkle in a wordy, needless reply around it. Fallacious at best.
"can we do something like that"?, That ain't it chief.
Another retort. I should hold a tally.
All i have been doing to this point is talking about the articles and trials that have been conducted on this drug, go directly quote me anywhere where i claimed anything directly on the effects of the drug outside of anything than potential therapeutic use. I'll wait on that. On the bottom line, you won't find them, because they don't exist.
I'm not really sure why you continue to fallaciously claim i have ignored anything; the only thing wrong here, is the fact that you choose to use things in your argument regarding trump that you very clearly didn't even bother to read about before you replied to me. Once again, we circle back to the fact that you're using dubious or as you claimed of me (Partially true) information. I think some people might call that ironic in hindsight. Your wider argument is not the issue here, it is your use of dubious information. And in that, as you do in a debate, you can pick out and reply to comments within it. It's really not your first day on debate forums, so i'm not really sure why you chose this route at all.
No, i do not. Nitpicking diction doesn't do your argument any favors either.
Lol, this kind of insinuation of feigned ignorance -- that you've gone to the well for several times now -- really does you exactly zero favors. Need to really try harder in that aspect. There's nothing i've "forgotten" at all.
Considering the fact that Hydroxychloroquine came back with antiviral effects to SARS-COV, that is not true at all. That is a clear foundation, overconfident as it may be.
In response to A:)Hm, Making the claim several times now that the use of this drug has "no basis" or "no foundation" when there has already been the research on the potential posted in a response is excessively intellectually dishonest -- you can go back to the well of what trump said, but this is not the point of my argument. The fact of the matter is, the potential use of this drug does indeed have a basis.
In response to B:)I haven't conflated anything in the slightest. Once again, and to something you very obviously have glossed over or ignored entirely, i included one article that came back urging caution for the use of Hydroxychloroquine in close to my initial reply to you. Once again we see your fallacious attempts to insinuate feigned ignorance.
Yeah this ain't it either chief, considering in one of my newest replies i said you're basically repeating what i have went over, I didn't gloss over it at all. Another winning reply.
This is called a false analogy, and yes, it is a fallacy. There is not a strong point you are even trying to get at in your "analogy".
Yeah, that's why you were called on it.
I really am not even remotely close to being sure why you felt the need to call people stupid in a discussion that you aren't even having with them, this kind of retort to people not even in this discussion is nothing more than eye roll inducing.
It's good to see you missed the point of the question. Even if it isn't surprising for people who know how ionizing radiation works, this is not the general public -- so that finding could very well be surprising to the general public. I didn't think it was a difficult concept for you to grasp, but apparently it was.
I don't even think i've come close to becoming political at all; as far as i am concerned we were discussing the effects of these drugs in our replies. Guess not? Also, anything "sarcastic" in reply is in direct reply to some of your comments that have exactly 0 use in the discussion. But yeah, you don't have to reply.
|
|
|
Post by creature386 on May 1, 2020 0:11:48 GMT 5
This spaceship metaphor for the quarantine by CGP Grey is just plain poetic: www.youtube.com/watch?v=snAhsXyO3CkSeriously though, separating these stations is surprisingly hard for me.
|
|
|
Post by sam1 on Jun 18, 2020 15:54:01 GMT 5
This is the actual truth. Won't find more awareness than that.
|
|
|
Post by brobear on Jun 27, 2020 3:13:55 GMT 5
SARS-CoV-2 coronavirus strain responsible for COVID-19 outbreak... Timed perfectly. A corrupt coalition of Communist China and the so-called Democrats in Washington ( Communists / Socialists ) what-ever label you wish to tag them with. This virus was no accident. Thank God for President Donald Trump. In 2016, the worst president in U.S. history was replaced by the best president in U.S. history. I will vote for Donald Trump in Nov.,2020. IF the Socialist Party wins, America is lost forever. I know that Trump can defeat Joe Biden ( with his Alzheimer's disease / Dementia ) in a fair election. But, I also know that the Leftists will cheat in every way possible.
|
|
|
Post by elosha11 on Jul 17, 2020 2:52:46 GMT 5
SARS-CoV-2 coronavirus strain responsible for COVID-19 outbreak... Timed perfectly. A corrupt coalition of Communist China and the so-called Democrats in Washington ( Communists / Socialists ) what-ever label you wish to tag them with. This virus was no accident. Thank God for President Donald Trump. In 2016, the worst president in U.S. history was replaced by the best president in U.S. history. I will vote for Donald Trump in Nov.,2020. IF the Socialist Party wins, America is lost forever. I know that Trump can defeat Joe Biden ( with his Alzheimer's disease / Dementia ) in a fair election. But, I also know that the Leftists will cheat in every way possible. This thread is mainly about the coronavirus and your post seems primarily political in nature. That said, I'm not sure how you could possibly think Trump is exhibiting good leadership on the coronavirus. Look at where our country is with the coronavirus compared to the rest of the western world, and most of Asia. I think he is likely to lose, and is going down as one of the worst Presidents in US history. He was the least fit person possible to handle this type of crisis.
|
|
|
Post by Ceratodromeus on Jul 18, 2020 13:13:01 GMT 5
When i donated blood they were offering free antibody testing, and i at one point had it. I suspect this is when i was super sick at the beginning of march.
|
|
|
Post by elosha11 on Jul 22, 2020 16:48:25 GMT 5
Glad you are fully recovered.
|
|
|
Post by creature386 on Jul 22, 2020 20:04:44 GMT 5
So am I.
|
|
talira
Junior Member Rank 1
Posts: 37
|
Post by talira on Aug 14, 2020 11:15:52 GMT 5
Australia's national death toll currently stands at 361. Many of the most recent deaths are linked to aged care facilities. A man in his 20s has become the youngest person in Australia to die from the virus and New Zealand has gone back into lockdown after four people from the same family tested positive.
|
|
|
Post by Infinity Blade on Aug 22, 2020 19:43:53 GMT 5
|
|