rock
Senior Member Rank 1
Posts: 1,586
|
Post by rock on May 5, 2019 6:28:47 GMT 5
I think Smilodon is overrated here. If the fight between these two escalated it was basically a wrestling match, strength contest. Because unlike modern big cats who clinch onto their prey and opponents with a bite and front legs, sabertooth cats needed to grapple their prey down before applying the bites..at least that's how I see it. And strength wise, the bear should still have the edge there. You may have a point sam1. I think I may give an edge to the grizzly. i back the grizzly here |
|
|
|
Post by sam1 on May 6, 2019 2:51:06 GMT 5
Actually I need to put this differently, seeing Vodmeisters charts on the second page of the thread.
That data suggests that Smilodon Fatalis was stronger than the Grizzly.
I'm not sure does it mean in relative or absolute terms though(as the bear'smax size far surpasses that of the sabertooth).
I still back Grizzly but only because I don't see smilodon using his teeth before succumbing the opponent whereas the bears have shown to fight in variety of techniques, including grappling with limbs, striking, and bite and shake.
|
|
|
|
Post by dinosauria101 on May 6, 2019 4:12:31 GMT 5
Actually I need to put this differently, seeing Vodmeisters charts on the second page of the thread. That data suggests that Smilodon Fatalis was stronger than the Grizzly. I'm not sure does it mean in relative or absolute terms though(as the bear'smax size far surpasses that of the sabertooth). I still back Grizzly but only because I don't see smilodon using his teeth before succumbing the opponent whereas the bears have shown to fight in variety of techniques, including grappling with limbs, striking, and bite and shake. Here is something else that may be of interest to you sam1 "The amount of power each human fibre type could produce increased from type I, to IIa to IIax fibres (P<0.01; Fig. 4F and Fig. 5B). These type IIa and IIax fibres produced 6 times and 11 times more power than type I fibres. Most significantly, the maximum power of lion type IIx fibres was 2.6 times greater than that of human type IIax fibres (with caracal IIx fibres unofficially producing 2.7 times greater power than human type IIax fibres). Maximum power obtained by the two lion type I fibres amounted to 8.48±0.92 kN m−2 FL s−1, which also seems well above the values obtained for the human type I and IIa fibres (not analysed statistically)." Even the lion's type 1 fibers were close to human type IIax (our most powerful); see figure 5." I do think Fatalis would have the initial advantage, but its relatively unwieldy kill method combined with low threshold for attrition makes me lean towards the bear as you do |
|
|
|
Post by sam1 on May 7, 2019 1:54:10 GMT 5
Actually I need to put this differently, seeing Vodmeisters charts on the second page of the thread. That data suggests that Smilodon Fatalis was stronger than the Grizzly. I'm not sure does it mean in relative or absolute terms though(as the bear'smax size far surpasses that of the sabertooth). I still back Grizzly but only because I don't see smilodon using his teeth before succumbing the opponent whereas the bears have shown to fight in variety of techniques, including grappling with limbs, striking, and bite and shake. Here is something else that may be of interest to you sam1 "The amount of power each human fibre type could produce increased from type I, to IIa to IIax fibres (P<0.01; Fig. 4F and Fig. 5B). These type IIa and IIax fibres produced 6 times and 11 times more power than type I fibres. Most significantly, the maximum power of lion type IIx fibres was 2.6 times greater than that of human type IIax fibres (with caracal IIx fibres unofficially producing 2.7 times greater power than human type IIax fibres). Maximum power obtained by the two lion type I fibres amounted to 8.48±0.92 kN m−2 FL s−1, which also seems well above the values obtained for the human type I and IIa fibres (not analysed statistically)." Even the lion's type 1 fibers were close to human type IIax (our most powerful); see figure 5." I do think Fatalis would have the initial advantage, but its relatively unwieldy kill method combined with low threshold for attrition makes me lean towards the bear as you do Yeah, I'd like to read the rest of that, if possible. Can you post the link? |
|
|
|
Post by dinosauria101 on May 7, 2019 3:59:15 GMT 5
Here is something else that may be of interest to you sam1 "The amount of power each human fibre type could produce increased from type I, to IIa to IIax fibres (P<0.01; Fig. 4F and Fig. 5B). These type IIa and IIax fibres produced 6 times and 11 times more power than type I fibres. Most significantly, the maximum power of lion type IIx fibres was 2.6 times greater than that of human type IIax fibres (with caracal IIx fibres unofficially producing 2.7 times greater power than human type IIax fibres). Maximum power obtained by the two lion type I fibres amounted to 8.48±0.92 kN m−2 FL s−1, which also seems well above the values obtained for the human type I and IIa fibres (not analysed statistically)." Even the lion's type 1 fibers were close to human type IIax (our most powerful); see figure 5." I do think Fatalis would have the initial advantage, but its relatively unwieldy kill method combined with low threshold for attrition makes me lean towards the bear as you do Yeah, I'd like to read the rest of that, if possible. Can you post the link? Just an excerpt from a real nasty website. Here's the link, I don't know where the rest came from carnivora.net/archive/index.php?thread-3203.html |
|
