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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 22, 2014 0:55:47 GMT 5
Problem is, if you're a democrat, you're suppose to believe in climate change, while republicans are expected not to believe. I normally vote republican simply because the democrats like to have a strong government, people with no rights, and a weak military. However, I also know that the republicans wouldn't care if the last tree was chopped down and every animal bigger than a squirrel was hunted into extinction. It's a no win.
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Post by theropod on Dec 22, 2014 3:30:07 GMT 5
I wasn’t aware of that. In what regard do democrats want people with no rights?
Better a strong government and a weak military than a weak government and a strong military imo. The latter sounds a lot like a military dictatorship.
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 22, 2014 4:01:52 GMT 5
By strong government, I mean power over the people; giving them no freedom of choice. Republicans believe in the people making more choices for themselves. Strong military; that is protecting the country. The democrats want power over the people. Little by little, America has been losing their freedoms.
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Post by theropod on Dec 22, 2014 11:05:22 GMT 5
Such as…?
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Post by malikc6 on Dec 22, 2014 11:11:40 GMT 5
I am independent. I have democratic and republican beliefs, but in the end, nothing matters. It all boils down to power and control, and other human flaws. There is no perfect or best government. All of it is just one big game. Play to win.
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 22, 2014 14:12:54 GMT 5
Such as, the right to protest in public. You will not see protesting today as was seen during the 60s. The right to choose if you want to wear a seat belt in your car. The adult right to light up a cigarette. Today, a person must hide to smoke a cigarette. I used to stop in at a local store where lots of men ( some ladies too ) would enjoy a few cold beers after work. People socialized in those days. Today, a man must take his beer home and hide to drink it. People don't socialize anymore. When I was a kid, my father had a pistol, a rifle, and a shot gun, all loaded all the time and in easy reach. I owned a 4-10 shot gun when I was 12 years old. I could carry it with me any time without asking - it was mine. I could walk to the store and buy my own shells. I started smoking ( regularly ) at about 11 years old - and bought my own; no questions asked. I started smoking in front of my parents when I was 14. I started drinking beer with my parents at about that same age.
Today, a 12 pack of beer will last me 10 or 12 days. I quit smoking in 1991. I don't own a gun. Another thing, my father would use his long leather belt to teach us right from wrong, anywhere any time, in front of any body. And, I carried a pocket knife always, even to school as most boys did.
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 22, 2014 14:22:49 GMT 5
I am independent. I have democratic and republican beliefs, but in the end, nothing matters. It all boils down to power and control, and other human flaws. There is no perfect or best government. All of it is just one big game. Play to win. |
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Post by malikc6 on Dec 22, 2014 15:17:28 GMT 5
I honestly feel like there is a new world order type thing going on, but Ill stop there. I can be quite the conspiracy theorist. Just look at human history. Everyone is trying to gain power over the other through several ways.
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Post by theropod on Dec 22, 2014 17:38:26 GMT 5
When I was a kid, my father had a pistol, a rifle, and a shot gun, all loaded all the time and in easy reach. I owned a 4-10 shot gun when I was 12 years old. I could carry it with me any time without asking - it was mine. I could walk to the store and buy my own shells. I started smoking ( regularly ) at about 11 years old - and bought my own; no questions asked. I started smoking in front of my parents when I was 14. I started drinking beer with my parents at about that same age.
[…] Another thing, my father would use his long leather belt to teach us right from wrong, anywhere any time, in front of any body. And, I carried a pocket knife always, even to school as most boys did. I’m sincerely sorry to read that you had to go through all that. But I’m not sure what point you want to make. Isn’t this precisely the reason why there should be laws that prevent children from carrying firearms, from being abused, and from doing drugs? That’s arguably because there was more to protest about in the 60s. That’s because stuff was worse back then, not because politicians were more liberal in that regard. Believe it or not, there are people dumb enough to not do it by themselves, so the government has to tell them to! I’m quite envious of that. You won’t believe how many times I’ve been at the bus stop while it was raining, and some idiot forced me to either get wet or breathe poisonous gases! This is a public health issue. Bad enough if one wants to kill oneself, but at least one shouldn’t do the same to others. Do you think the government is responsible for people”s social behaviour? Public consumption of alkoholic drinks isn’t illegal in the US, or did I get that wrong? Maybe it’s just a change in culture, and drinking isn’t so popular any more. Those all sound like very positive developments to me. American gun laws are still way too liberal, but apparently it has gotten better. No, there certainly is no perfect government, and Obama certainly isn’t perfect either. But at least he did try to change a few things, such as instituting a proper healthcare system, no matter how miserably it seems to have failed. |
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 23, 2014 1:53:49 GMT 5
I remember sitting in my car ( just a few years ago ) waiting for my granddaughter to get out of elementary school. All the kids standing out in front, three long rows of car ( chilly weather ) all idelling and the carbon monoxide going thick all over the kids. No teacher or parent seemed even to notice. But, just let someone light up a cigarette... panic!
Sorry I went through what - freedom. I should have the right to choose whether or not to wear a seat belt. In elementary school ( North Carolina ) when 2 boys got into a fight, the teachers simply observed, and let them finish it themselves. In life, there is not always a hero standing by.
Safety and good health is good, but freedom of choice is better. When men could stop off and a local corner store or service station and enjoy a few cold beers with friends, that was a good thing. People socialized and one could easily find a job. There is where you could get to know every carpenter, painter, plumber, etc. American people are now suppressed and up-tight about everything. Just about every boy in school carried a Barlow pocket knife and a Zippo lighter; but when 2 boys got into a fight, there was no pulling out a knife or a gang joining in. We had an unwritten code of honor ( probably due to the cowboy tv shows and movies of the time ). Oh, and our knives were not hidden; parents and teacher knew about them and considered them as standard boy stuff. Times are much worse today than 50 years ago. |
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Post by theropod on Dec 23, 2014 11:08:12 GMT 5
Sorry to read you were mistreatrd by your father. Freedom shouldn't be the freedom to beat your children. I can't change your feelings in that regard, but 12 year olds being allowed to carry guns is a violation of public safety. Code of honour or not, children that age are not responsible enough to carry a weapon that can literally kill someone on the press of a button. Bad enough that their parents have them.
Also, the carbon monoxide thingy would only be because American guidelines for cars aren't strict enough. That one thing wasn't worked out yet doesn't mean one has to revert every other change.
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Post by malikc6 on Dec 23, 2014 11:19:33 GMT 5
I guess theropod is against corporal punishment. A lot of mothers/fathers did that back then. At a time, there was no child abuse laws. Kids/teens would get beaten with water hoses, switches from trees, extension cords, etc. I'm not exactly all for that as I think a leatherbelt is good enough, but I do think that back then, kids were a lot better disciplined. Also after the spanking/beating, the parents would make their children feel ashamed for what they did.
Today, a lot of people seem to think that spanking your kid is child abuse. I say it depends. Causing bruising and losing a lot of blood along with bones being broken is going way too far, but I see nothing wrong with getting swatted a couple times with a leather belt. Some people say that instead of just spanking/beating them, just take away their privileges, but the kid could just wait until he or she gets it back. Even if its permanently, at some point in time, they know they're going to get something. They take advantage of their parents over time, and I've seen this too many times in action. I've seen the parents become the kids and the kids become the parents. It's embarrassing and truly disrespectful towards the parents.
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 23, 2014 15:57:55 GMT 5
Sorry to read you were mistreatrd by your father. Freedom shouldn't be the freedom to beat your children. I can't change your feelings in that regard, but 12 year olds being allowed to carry guns is a violation of public safety. Code of honour or not, children that age are not responsible enough to carry a weapon that can literally kill someone on the press of a button. Bad enough that their parents have them. Also, the carbon monoxide thingy would only be because American guidelines for cars aren't strict enough. That one thing wasn't worked out yet doesn't mean one has to revert every other change. I was not abused by my father; I was punished when I did wrong. My love and respect for my father was and is deep. I lived out in the country where most kids from around 11 or 12 owned a gun, and I never heard of even an accidental shooting of anyone; we were taught by our fathers the proper use of knives and guns. Our generation did not have school shootings and such. Why couldn't a restaurant or night club have a sign on the door reading either "smoking" or "non-smoking"?, giving both the owner of the establishment and the customers the freedom of choice. You seem to want a dictator making your choices for you. I grew up with both parents smoking. They smoked in the house and in the car; even at the drive-in movies. It never bothered me or my two brothers one bit. people smoked everywhere, even while grocery shopping. I never remember anyone complaining about the smoke; not until the media started filling their heads with fear. The more freedoms are taken from the people, the more the people get used to having their government dictate their lives. I guess that if you live in the USA, you would have to be somewhere between 45 and 55 to even remember freedom and making your own choices.
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Post by theropod on Dec 23, 2014 19:02:04 GMT 5
By "filling their heads with fear" I assume what you are referring to "informing them of the high associated risk of lung cancer and countless other fatal or debilitating diseases". Of course the smell of smoking doesn’t bother you if you are used to it, that’s not the point.
But there are plain medical reasons why children shouldn’t drink alcohol, and neither should they smoke. If you consider them mature enough to do both (which they are not, most do it because of peer pressure, to appear cool–why else should they?), why don’t you also give 11-year olds the right to vote? Believe me, it would be a blessing if smoking regulations where I live were more like they are in the US now.
Since there were and still are parents not responsible enough to take care of that themselves, there has to be someone else who does. Same for violence. Possible that what your father did was appropriate, possible that it was not. But the point is, who gets to decide what is appropriate, and who prevents what is not if there is no law to do so? If you give every parent the right to do to their children as they please, that will certainly result in child abuse. And it’s really the same thing you complain about with the government dictating their lives; if this is generally accepted and encouraged, nobody will do anything against it.
As for accidental shootings, one hears that kind of thing all the time now (little children killing their parents accidentally or out of a rage), so perhaps the government simply had to react to an increasing need for regulation on that regard. The same applies to school shootings. If there wasn’t such easy access to guns for everyone, without a license, without even an age limit (there are even age limits for riding a bike in traffic!), people also couldn’t walk into a school that easily with a gun. Whatever the reasons for what you describe are, they have got nothing to do with the government being more liberal when you were young.
I don’t want a dictator, but I want centralised legislation on important subjects like these (and one made by a civil government, not the military btw). Saying I seem to want a dictatorship is like saying you are an anarchist. Are you?
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 23, 2014 21:41:05 GMT 5
Too much fat is bad for you, as is too much sugar. Perhaps the government should issue out our daily menus. Perhaps such places as Mcdonalds and Dairy Queen should be shut down. Stop the production of candy, ice cream, and other sweets. Have the meats inspected to insure there is no visible fat. Outlaw all fried foods. Sound like a good idea? What about skin cancer. should we outlaw laying out on the beach altogether, or simply limit the time a person is allowed on the beach unless completely covered in something like an Arabian robe and turban. Maybe limit a person to 1 hour; or is that too much exposure? Perhaps children under ( what age? 15 or 16 ) should not be allowed out of the house without a parent or legal guardian. Maybe women should always have an escort such as husband, brother, father, etc.? Where does safety end? |
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