Acherontisuchus guajirensis vs. Titanoboa cerrejonensis

[dinosauria101]

Acherontisuchus guajirensis
Acherontisuchus is an extinct genus of dyrosaurid neosuchian from Middle to Late Paleocene deposits of Colombia.[1] The only known species is A. guajiraensis, whose name means "Acheron crocodile of the Guajira Peninsula".[2] Acherontisuchus is found in multiple layers between coal seams, giving it a wide time distribution throughout the formation. Another dyrosaurid called Cerrejonisuchus was named from Cerrejón in 2010, but is only found in one layer of the formation. Aside from the consistently fractured fossils, no evidence exists of an altered fossil size.[2] Acherontisuchus is considered a long-snouted, or longirostrine, dyrosaurid. Its snout is shorter than those of Dyrosaurus, Atlantosuchus, Rhabdognathus, and Congosaurus. Some of its teeth have pronounced grooves on both sides. The upper jaw is wide rather than high. Its head is estimated to have been 72–86 centimetres (28–34 in) long, about midsize for a dyrosaurid. It grew to a relatively large size compared to most dyrosaurids, between 4.66 and 6.46 metres (15.3 and 21.2 ft).[2]

vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/dinosaurs/images/b/b3/Acherontisuchus.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20140207230356

Titanoboa cerrejonensis
Titanoboa, meaning "titanic boa," is a genus of snake that lived approximately 58–60 million years ago, during the Paleocene epoch, a 10-million-year period immediately following the dinosaur extinction event. The only known species is the Titanoboa cerrejonensis, the largest snake ever discovered, which supplanted the previous record holder, Gigantophis. By comparing the sizes and shapes of its fossilized vertebrae to those of extant snakes, researchers estimated that the largest individuals of T. cerrejonensis found had a total length around 14.6 m (48 ft) and weighed about 2,000 kg (4,400 lb).

thumbs-prod.si-cdn.com/4mKH22HWm-MVLLwexQJE8eETbkw=/fit-in/1072x0/https://public-media.si-cdn.com/filer/Titanoboa-Monster-dinosaurs-2.jpg

Credit to Wikipedia

sharkboy101, here it is!

[sam1]

Looks like a missmatch to me. Snake is too big.

[dinosauria101]

sam1

Based on modern crocodiles, this one is most likely 600 kg-2 tons, a mean of 1.3 tons.
I would favor the snake but it is close. I'd back a crocodile over a constrictor about 70/30 at parity (massive jaws, durability, and hard to get a good grip on), so this is more even than you'd think

[sharkboy101]

This is one of the best matches, according to most articles the snake never went after large adults.

[sharkboy101]

I kinda wanna see a size comparison between the two

[sam1]

Yeah but the snake was also likely a fish eater actually, according to some findings.
And it is still too large for a croc to control, and kill.
Judging by the picture, the croc's jaws don't look potent enough. I've seen alligators struggling to do damage on small pythons..one can only try to imagine how tough and durable titanoboa probably was.

[dinosauria101]

Oct 12, 2019 1:01:27 GMT 5 sharkboy101 said:

This is one of the best matches, according to most articles the snake never went after large adults.

I agree, it would be too much of a risk involved for the snake. I would favor it more often than not but the chances of the crocodile winning are high enough that it won't risk it

sam1

Here you go! 4.66 and 6.46 Acherontisuchus (scaled up Cerrejonisuchus from Prehistoric Wildlife) vs average Titanoboa (also from Prehistoric Wildlife)

[dinosauria101]

Oct 12, 2019 1:08:30 GMT 5 sam1 said:

Yeah but the snake was also likely a fish eater actually, according to some findings.
And it is still too large for a croc to control, and kill.
Judging by the picture, the croc's jaws don't look potent enough. I've seen alligators struggling to do damage on small pythons..one can only try to imagine how tough and durable titanoboa probably was.

Well, maybe not. Don't discount the croc just because its jaws look too thin.
Amazon river dolphins, which have very thin jaws and small, conical teeth (see here, hyperlink) are able to seriously damage and kill similar sized/sizable animals (bearing in mind a fellow dolphin would have blubber which would in theory help protect it). Here are some accounts from the Baryonyx vs Daspletosaurus thread:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amazon_river_dolphin
''Later, it was shown that males were larger than females and are documented wielding an aggressive sexual behavior in the wild and in captivity. Males often have a significant degree of damage in the dorsal, caudal, and pectoral fins as well as the blowhole due to bites and abrasions, in addition to the numerous secondary teeth-raking scars. This suggests fierce competition for access to females, with a polygynous mating system, though polyandry and promiscuity cannot be excluded.''

editors.eol.org/eoearth/wiki/Amazon_River_dolphin
''Botos do not appear to establish a social hierarchy through aggression in captivity, but violent acts are not uncommon and have even resulted in the death of some individuals.
However, males are now known to be larger than females, and very aggressive sexual behavior in males has been observed. Some authors have observed hostility between pink botos in the wild, while others have noted extremely aggressive activity during copulation in captivity. Males also have a higher degree of damaged fins, flukes, and blowholes due to biting and abrasion, in addition to more abundant scarring due to tooth-raking. This evidence suggests that there may be intense competition for access to females.''

www.nationalgeographic.com/magazine/2009/06/dolphins/
"The males beat the hell out of each other," says Martin. "They are brutal. They can snap each other's jaws, tails, flippers, lacerate blowholes. The large males are literally covered with scar tissue."

So basically, these river dolphins with small, conical teeth and long, thin jaws are able so seriously injure and kill similar sized animals with some degree of protection. Acherontisuchus seems to have significantly more robust jaws and sharper teeth than the Amazon river dolphin. I would not be surprised if the crocodile could fatally injure the snake with a few well placed bites.

[sharkboy101]

Nice comparison

[sam1]

The amazon river dolphin info is interesting, but I really don't see how it is a good example.
Your comparison just confirms how outmatched the crocodile is. Not a chance vs the titanoboa unless biting it on the head..again, even the common pythons are extremely tough qne resilient , alligators have a really hard time with them. A large constrictor's skin is hard to cut even with a knife..can you imagine how a Boto would fare against that?

[dinosauria101]

Oct 13, 2019 19:59:21 GMT 5 sam1 said:

1: The amazon river dolphin info is interesting, but I really don't see how it is a good example.
2: Your comparison just confirms how outmatched the crocodile is. Not a chance vs the titanoboa unless biting it on the head..
3: again, even the common pythons are extremely tough qne resilient , alligators have a really hard time with them.
4: A large constrictor's skin is hard to cut even with a knife..can you imagine how a Boto would fare against that?

1: How not? You said you didn't think thin jaws would be able to do much damage. I wanted to show otherwise
Moreover, Acherontisuchus looks closer to an Orinoco crocodile (which does have a slender front snout but can prey on large land animals) than a gharial, so its bite should be even more potent
2: How? Are you referring to visual size? The crocodile would be significantly wider from top view. As for not a chance, I'll address that later on
3: Well, maybe it's because alligators have blunt teeth and crushing bites. Great for killing bony animals, but not heavily muscled ones like a snake. I believe Acherontisuchus would fare better due to sharper teeth; have you seen what Nile crocodiles, with blunt teeth, can do to zebras (disemboweling)? I see something similar happening at max size
4: Acherontisuchus would likely do well with that due to sharp teeth and deathrolling ability