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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 2, 2014 17:00:06 GMT 5
They lived during the same time period, but were an ocean apart. The Ngandong tiger ( Panthera tigris soloensis ) was ( as far as we know ) the largest of the Pantherinae. Smilodon populator was ( as far as we know ) the biggest ever Machairodontinae. In a face-off confrontation, who would live and who would die? Which of these monsters was the king of the big cats?
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Post by Vodmeister on Dec 3, 2014 13:10:24 GMT 5
New data suggests that Ngandong tiger was barely any larger than a modern day Siberian tiger, it averaged around 235 kg (518 pounds). The S. populator would walk this match-up. Here's the humerus bone of a modern Siberian tiger (P. tigris altaica) compared to that of a Ngandong tiger (P. tigris soloensis Ngandong). As you can see, the bones are almost identical in size, with the humerus of the Ngandong tiger being just 8.5 mm longer.  |
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 3, 2014 15:46:41 GMT 5
Thanks Vodmeister. It seems like yesterday when "the guys" on the old AVA were discussing an average weight of about 800 pounds for the Ngandong tiger. So, I suppose this to be a mismatch.
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Post by Infinity Blade on Dec 4, 2014 2:53:38 GMT 5
Even a sabertooth the size of the tiger would win.
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Post by 0ldgrizz on Dec 7, 2014 7:38:53 GMT 5
Even a sabertooth the size of the tiger would win. So, do you believe that Smilodon fatalis could defeat a Bengal tiger ? |
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Post by malikc6 on Dec 7, 2014 7:42:37 GMT 5
Even a sabertooth the size of the tiger would win. So, do you believe that Smilodon fatalis could defeat a Bengal tiger ? That would be quite an interesting fight. |
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Post by Infinity Blade on Dec 7, 2014 8:23:52 GMT 5
Even a sabertooth the size of the tiger would win. So, do you believe that Smilodon fatalis could defeat a Bengal tiger ? Yes. |
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Post by Godzillasaurus on Dec 8, 2014 2:05:25 GMT 5
Smilodon's killing weapons were vastly superior, but wasn't the tiger among the largest of all felids if I am correct (much larger than smilodon)?
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Post by Godzillasaurus on Dec 8, 2014 2:09:32 GMT 5
New data suggests that Ngandong tiger was barely any larger than a modern day Siberian tiger, it averaged around 235 kg (518 pounds). The S. populator would walk this match-up. Here's the humerus bone of a modern Siberian tiger (P. tigris altaica) compared to that of a Ngandong tiger (P. tigris soloensis Ngandong). As you can see, the bones are almost identical in size, with the humerus of the Ngandong tiger being just 8.5 mm longer. I see... I thought that the Ngandong tiger was significantly larger, but that was from information given to me a while back. Wasn't smilodon just barely shy of the size of the largest modern tiger? Like perhaps in the size range of an African lion? |
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Post by malikc6 on Dec 8, 2014 2:17:47 GMT 5
Don't you guys think the Sabre tooth cat's long teeth would break in this fight? I honestly feel like those are vulnerable for chipping and breaking, especially when in a intense fight and a fight like this would be anything but easy.
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Post by Godzillasaurus on Dec 8, 2014 2:25:51 GMT 5
Well yes, they would be more frail than the shorter canines of most other felids when it comes to nashing-based fighting as opposed to accurate biting (which is how it would have probably killed by biting the neck, as with pretty much all other felids).
Then again, the teeth of all carnivorans technically were not designed for this
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Post by mechafire on Dec 8, 2014 4:56:22 GMT 5
Smilodon's killing weapons were vastly superior, but wasn't the tiger among the largest of all felids if I am correct (much larger than smilodon)? the tiger is the heaviest around today. Smilodon fatalis might be around the same size, but I'm pretty sure smilodon populator is much bigger. |
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Post by malikc6 on Dec 8, 2014 5:07:02 GMT 5
I think my guess is the tiger here. They are both great grapplers, but the smilodon would have trouble getting the killing the bite. The tiger would actually have the better bite force based off of how their jaws are designed. The Sabertooth would have to somehow get the tiger in a position to bite through the neck just right and I don't see that happening to another carnivorous creature like the tiger who is also going to try to get it in a position to bite the throat, or even go for stomach bites.
The Sabertooth cat likely had trouble fighting and hunting because everything had to be accurate, or it would risk losing their long knife like fangs. I guarantee that in the fight, it will lose its fangs before it could grapple the tiger to the ground, and even without their fangs, their bite isn't that great.
I also read a source about the weight of this tiger, and it appears to also have a weight advantage so I'm giving it to the striped cat.
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Post by mechafire on Dec 8, 2014 5:36:13 GMT 5
I think my guess is the tiger here. They are both great grapplers, but the smilodon would have trouble getting the killing the bite. The tiger would actually have the better bite force based off of how their jaws are designed. The Sabertooth would have to somehow get the tiger in a position to bite through the neck just right and I don't see that happening to another carnivorous creature like the tiger who is also going to try to get it in a position to bite the throat, or even go for stomach bites. The Sabertooth cat likely had trouble fighting and hunting because everything had to be accurate, or it would risk losing their long knife like fangs. I guarantee that in the fight, it will lose its fangs before it could grapple the tiger to the ground, and even without their fangs, their bite isn't that great. I also read a source about the weight of this tiger, and it appears to also have a weight advantage so I'm giving it to the striped cat. I would say the Smilodon would win. The tiger's bite may be harder but the longer fangs of the saber tooth would be more damaging. They are both good at grappling sure. But I think smilodon's would have an advantage there. With its larger upper body and claws. I think you underestimat the durability of those teeth. Although they are weaker than the conical teeth of today's cats, they don't break THAT easily. The fact that they were used constantly and don't grow back shows me they could be useful in struggles and not break. I have seen no source that proves this tiger is larger. Vod showed it was only as a little larger than modern tigers, and smilodon populator is about as heavy as they come. |
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Post by malikc6 on Dec 8, 2014 6:13:23 GMT 5
Mecha fire, how much force does it take to break a fang of that size?
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