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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 12, 2019 15:17:52 GMT 5
American Lion - Panthera leo atrox The American lion (Panthera leo atrox or P. atrox) — also known as the North American lion, Naegele’s giant jaguar or American cave lion — is an extinct lion of the family Felidae, endemic to North America during the Pleistocene epoch (0.34 mya to 11,000 years ago), existing for approximately 0.33 million years. It has been shown by genetic analysis to be a sister lineage to the Eurasian cave lion (Panthera leo spelaea or P. spelaea). The American lion is an extinct animal which originated in North America and went on to colonize part of South America as part of the Great American Interchange. The head-body length of the American lion is estimated to have been 1.6–2.5 m (5 ft 3 in–8 ft 2 in) and it would have stood 1.2 metres (4 ft) at the shoulder. Thus it was smaller than its contemporary competitor for prey, the giant short-faced bear, which was the largest carnivoran of North America at the time. The American lion was not as heavily built as the saber-toothed cat Smilodon populator, which may have weighed up to 360–470 kilograms (790–1,000 lb). Sorkin (2008) estimated it to weigh roughly 420 kilograms (930 lb), but new estimations show a top weight of 351 kg (774lbs.) for the largest specimen and an average weight for males of 255.65 kg (563lbs.).  Smilodon fatalis Smilodon fatalis ("the deadly knife-tooth") is possibly the best-known of the machairodontine saber-toothed cats. It appeared in North America about 1.6 million years ago and later migrated down the west coast of the continent to Peru. It became extinct around 10,000 years ago. This species is estimated to have ranged from 160 to 280 kg (350 to 620 lb). Particularly large specimens could weigh 350 kg. Their teeth are about 7 in. Although the saber-toothed cat has no close living relatives, paleontologists reconstruct how the saber-toothed cat looked by comparing its bones with those of large cats living today. Very powerful front legs and a short tail indicate that saber-toothed cats used stealth and ambush rather than speed to capture their prey. Recent investigations suggest that this saber-toothed cat probably used its long canines to slash through the throat, severing the wind pipe and cutting the jugular. Its teeth were surprisingly delicate and could easily snap off if a prey animal struggled. Its mouth could open up to 120 degrees, whereas its closest living relative, Panthera leo, or lion, can only open its jaws to 65 degrees.  Credit to Wikipedia |
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rock
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Post by rock on Jun 12, 2019 18:31:41 GMT 5
i think the american lion wins here , i think it can even beat s.populator , so it wins mid diff , it is heavier , larger and has a better bite .
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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 13, 2019 5:21:39 GMT 5
i think the american lion wins here , i think it can even beat s.populator , so it wins mid diff , it is heavier , larger and has a better bite . Care to explain in more detail? The difference is only 36 kilograms, and Smilodon fatalis was much more robust and had a very efficient kill method (against this type of animal) |
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rock
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Post by rock on Jun 13, 2019 16:29:46 GMT 5
i think the american lion wins here , i think it can even beat s.populator , so it wins mid diff , it is heavier , larger and has a better bite . Care to explain in more detail? The difference is only 36 kilograms, and Smilodon fatalis was much more robust and had a very efficient kill method (against this type of animal) american lion grew a little bit bigger and was a bit more robust , check this video out for more of what i mean |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 13, 2019 16:31:22 GMT 5
Care to explain in more detail? The difference is only 36 kilograms, and Smilodon fatalis was much more robust and had a very efficient kill method (against this type of animal) american lion grew a little bit bigger and was a bit more robust , check this video out for more of what i mean 36 kilos. And if you just were to take a look at their skeletons, the machairodont would be the more robust. You can tell if there's more muscle/bone in less area |
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rock
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Post by rock on Jun 13, 2019 16:33:37 GMT 5
american lion grew a little bit bigger and was a bit more robust , check this video out for more of what i mean 36 kilos. And if you just were to take a look at their skeletons, the machairodont would be the more robust. You can tell if there's more muscle/bone in less area wait , i have a quick question before we contuine , how is the kangaroo vs wolf match a mismatch? the kangaroo has very powerful hind legs and can kick the wolf and kill him or hurt him , plus isnt he larger? i still delated it btw |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 13, 2019 16:35:43 GMT 5
36 kilos. And if you just were to take a look at their skeletons, the machairodont would be the more robust. You can tell if there's more muscle/bone in less area wait , i have a quick question before we contuine , how is the kangaroo vs wolf match a mismatch? the kangaroo has very powerful hind legs and can kick the wolf and kill him or hurt him , plus isnt he larger? i still delated it btw It's not large enough, and the legs are not strong enough to kill the wolf before being killed. That's why an African wild dog or dingo (I just made that 2nd one) would be a lot closer fight Now, where were we? |
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rock
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Post by rock on Jun 13, 2019 16:39:37 GMT 5
wait , i have a quick question before we contuine , how is the kangaroo vs wolf match a mismatch? the kangaroo has very powerful hind legs and can kick the wolf and kill him or hurt him , plus isnt he larger? i still delated it btw It's not large enough, and the legs are not strong enough to kill the wolf before being killed. That's why an African wild dog or dingo (I just made that 2nd one) would be a lot closer fight Now, where were we? ok , but i do think the lion would win here , i think if it was smilodon populator it would be very close with the smilodon having the slight edge |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 13, 2019 16:42:42 GMT 5
It's not large enough, and the legs are not strong enough to kill the wolf before being killed. That's why an African wild dog or dingo (I just made that 2nd one) would be a lot closer fight Now, where were we? ok , but i do think the lion would win here , i think if it was smilodon populator it would be very close with the smilodon having the slight edge And again, what's the reasoning there? I agree the lion has a chance, but for me, Smilodon fatalis' superior attributes even the odds |
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rock
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Post by rock on Jun 13, 2019 16:46:15 GMT 5
ok , but i do think the lion would win here , i think if it was smilodon populator it would be very close with the smilodon having the slight edge And again, what's the reasoning there? I agree the lion has a chance, but for me, Smilodon fatalis' superior attributes even the odds both smilodon and american lion have been downsized and there is no evidance against these two being downsized from any scientific sources so both s.populator , s.fatalis and american lion are downsized , but although this is pretty close i give the edge to the lion , as it was more heavily built [more built like a grizzly bear than a big cat] has a bigger bite force [remember the sabertooth tigers teeth may have looked big , but they were very bad at grappling fleash in reailty] and it has a speed advantage , however the smilodon does have a bit of a chance here . |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 13, 2019 16:49:17 GMT 5
And again, what's the reasoning there? I agree the lion has a chance, but for me, Smilodon fatalis' superior attributes even the odds both smilodon and american lion have been downsized and there is no evidance against these two being downsized from any scientific sources so both s.populator , s.fatalis and american lion are downsized , but although this is pretty close i give the edge to the lion , as it was more heavily built [more built like a grizzly bear than a big cat] has a bigger bite force [remember the sabertooth tigers teeth may have looked big , but they were very bad at grappling fleash in reailty] and it has a speed advantage , however the smilodon does have a bit of a chance here . 1: Downsized......you could say that. The current mass estimates for the American lion and Smilodon fatalis are 256 kg and 220 kg, respectively. 2: Seriously, that applies more to Smilodon fatalis. Even going by the OP, it's a good deal more robust 3: The kill method for Fatalis is stabbing canines into the foe's throat. That's very efficient and could dispatch the lion quickly 4: Speed is irrelevant in close quarter combat |
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rock
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Post by rock on Jun 13, 2019 16:54:03 GMT 5
both smilodon and american lion have been downsized and there is no evidance against these two being downsized from any scientific sources so both s.populator , s.fatalis and american lion are downsized , but although this is pretty close i give the edge to the lion , as it was more heavily built [more built like a grizzly bear than a big cat] has a bigger bite force [remember the sabertooth tigers teeth may have looked big , but they were very bad at grappling fleash in reailty] and it has a speed advantage , however the smilodon does have a bit of a chance here . 1: Downsized......you could say that. The current mass estimates for the American lion and Smilodon fatalis are 256 kg and 220 kg, respectively. 2: Seriously, that applies more to Smilodon fatalis. Even going by the OP, it's a good deal more robust 3: The kill method for Fatalis is stabbing canines into the foe's throat. That's very efficient and could dispatch the lion quickly 4: Speed is irrelevant in close quarter combat according to some sources smilodon very rarley used its teeth to kill other predators but more or less used them to kill prey www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/how-did-sabercats-use-their-fangs-180962604/4:true if this is taking place in a close quater arena |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 13, 2019 16:56:44 GMT 5
1: Downsized......you could say that. The current mass estimates for the American lion and Smilodon fatalis are 256 kg and 220 kg, respectively. 2: Seriously, that applies more to Smilodon fatalis. Even going by the OP, it's a good deal more robust 3: The kill method for Fatalis is stabbing canines into the foe's throat. That's very efficient and could dispatch the lion quickly 4: Speed is irrelevant in close quarter combat according to some sources smilodon very rarley used its teeth to kill other predators but more or less used them to kill prey www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/how-did-sabercats-use-their-fangs-180962604/4:true if this is taking place in a close quater arena 1: It didn't use them to kill other predators because that was too risky. In a death match, it won't stop until it's dead, so it'd very likely use them |
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rock
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Post by rock on Jun 13, 2019 16:58:51 GMT 5
1: It didn't use them to kill other predators because that was too risky. In a death match, it won't stop until it's dead, so it'd very likely use them it can try to use them and possibly suceed , but evidance also suggests that its teeth were fragile so there is a possibilty that it can break off. |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Jun 13, 2019 17:02:13 GMT 5
1: It didn't use them to kill other predators because that was too risky. In a death match, it won't stop until it's dead, so it'd very likely use them it can try to use them and possibly suceed , but evidance also suggests that its teeth were fragile so there is a possibilty that it can break off. That is SIDE TO SIDE. Its method involved more up and down than anything else, which its teeth were very resistant to |
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