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Post by dinosauria101 on Oct 11, 2023 3:32:47 GMT 5
I'm flabbergasted I never made this connection before (in terms of time jumps=no WWD style narrative). If there are indeed time jumps in LOOP, considering it's analogous to my favorite WWM in terms of being an evolutionary centered palaeodocumentary, then those time jumps are highly desirable for the sake of the narrative. Despite the lack of WWM-style evolution sequences, the sheer range of animals they are showing will really help the evolutionary narrative. I believe I mentioned in the WWM thread that such a narrative mitigates my complaints about a jumping around narrative for WWM like I have for documentaries such as Prehistoric Planet, and such mitigation would apply here too. EDIT: Never mind that, I made that realization earlier on and forgot about it completely. But at least now I remember it! theropod , just a thought. I never thought about this until now, but it looks like your gripe with the Deinonychus being too uniformly dark may not necessarily be the case. Of course there is no telling for sure until October 25, but I think the reason the ones in that image look so artificially uniform is due to being in the shade - it's hard to tell for the one that its not thanks to it being in the distance, but it does not look as uniform. Most likely a visual equivalent of things like teasers using pig squeal placeholder SFX for the terror bird. As for Exalt , I found a front image of WWB's woolly mammoths to compare with the LOOP one. Having never shampooed a furry animal I can't know what it would look like, but WWB's woolly mammoths certainly look more ragged and realistic than the LOOP woolly mammoth to my eye - so relative to WWB at least the LOOP one probably is shampooed.  |
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Post by theropod on Oct 11, 2023 4:26:07 GMT 5
Who knows, before we’ve seen the programme we cannot definitely say whether there will be something like the WWM evolution sequences in it, although it is not very likely. I am curious to see how they are going to tie the differens segments in each episode together.
I suppose for you that will largely depend on how it is executed. If the individual segments are relatively short, it could end up feeling more like PP to you in terms of a lack of coherent, long-form storytelling in each episode, but if executed differently, there might be ways to tie these segments together into a coherent whole. We’re just gonna have to wait and see and try to enjoy whatever it ends up being.
We’ll see. As I already wrote, I do hope that the still just makes it look worse than it really is. Now I doubt that all my issues with it will go away due to this (the feather shape very likely won’t), but maybe the coloration is something that just looks particularly bad due to the lighting in this particular shot, that’s indeed quite possible. Many things tend to be perceived differently when you actually see something in motion than when just looking at a still (anyone who’s ever had an unflattering photo of themselves taken knows that lol)
Agreed regarding the mammoth. While it doesn’t bother me as much as the Deinonychus (but that’s probably just my dinosaur bias talking), it just somehow looks too clean and too fluffy. Sure, a mammoth is fluffy, but it should have long, water-repellant, relatively course guard hair on top of the softer, fluffier underwool, and none of that should look as much like a freshly shampooed puppy as it does in that picture. So while from an visual standpoint it looks very nice, that is precisely the problem, it sort of looks too "perfect", not rough or filthy enough.
Somehow from what footage I’ve seen so far, I suspect I’m going to enjoy the paleozoic segments the most. There’s less feathers and hair to content with (which they seem to struggle with a bit). Of course part of that is simply me not being much of an expert on paleozoic animals, hence why I’m probably less critical of their depictions from an accuracy standpoint than I am with, say, mesozoic reptiles. But it’s also a genuinely long and interesting era that’s been sorely underutilized so far, so I think it’s also going to have a lot more novelty and a lot more value in terms of scientific outreach than the 20th documentary portrayal of T. rex and Triceratops, or mammoths and sabre-toothed cats.
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Post by Infinity Blade on Oct 11, 2023 4:46:09 GMT 5
I'm kind of crossing my fingers that we'll see just how effective pareiasaurs were in defense (size, armor, even defensive head spikes in the case of Scutosaurus). Granted, I think we've seen a part where one is tackled down by a gorgonopsid (and is decidedly not winning), but it could be there'll be more to that scene.
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Post by dinosauria101 on Oct 11, 2023 5:41:00 GMT 5
Who knows, before we’ve seen the programme we cannot definitely say whether there will be something like the WWM evolution sequences in it, although it is not very likely. I am curious to see how they are going to tie the differens segments in each episode together. Somehow from what footage I’ve seen so far, I suspect I’m going to enjoy the paleozoic segments the most. There’s less feathers and hair to content with (which they seem to struggle with a bit). Of course part of that is simply me not being much of an expert on paleozoic animals, hence why I’m probably less critical of their depictions from an accuracy standpoint than I am with, say, mesozoic reptiles. But it’s also a genuinely long and interesting era that’s been sorely underutilized so far, so I think it’s also going to have a lot more novelty and a lot more value in terms of scientific outreach than the 20th documentary portrayal of T. rex and Triceratops, or mammoths and sabre-toothed cats. I guess waiting and watching would be best for both the first thing and all the removed stuff. But - as probably no one is surprised to hear - if my definitive rule out of evolution sequences is erroneous against the odds I will be eating my popcorn twice as fast as any other depiction, no matter how otherwise good it is.  I was at first not as excited about the Palaeozoic animals because the initial trailer left me much more confused than excited for what there would be and kind of worried there would not be much (only showing Arthropleura for the Palaeozoic teasing is not exactly what I'd call the ideal preview). The new trailers and the episode reveal change all that - I think I'm with you that I'll enjoy it the most, given how it's a new and apparently thorough take on the ground my favorite palaeodocumentary covered. That said, I am more excited for everything than I would otherwise be. There's something to be said about ONE SHOW - not even a trilogy - that has everything from Cameroceras to Diplodocus to Smilodon, and it gives me the exact same spectacular primordial feeling I get about WWM which is really breathtaking. I also have a notable interest in the Smilodon/terror bird scene (what will they show them doing given knowledge nowadays?), the Sinraptor/Anchiornis (I want more proper Sinraptor screen time after proper PD Sinraptor being a minor character and DR Sinraptors being too whacky to take seriously), the sauropod river scene (so novel to have sauropods swept away by fast flowing water!) and the woolly mammoth/cave lion scene (which looks just plain exciting from the trailer). Infinity Blade , my guess is that if LOOP has the pariesaur get killed, it may be following the principle of demonstrating the formidability of pariesaurs by only having unhealthy ones get killed. I always got that impression from WWM not having the gorgonopsid kill a healthy one so it's one theory I like. But, I will say this: it would be pretty cool to see the pariesaur get away by rolling on the gorgonopsid and stabbing with its spikes or something! |
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Post by Infinity Blade on Oct 11, 2023 6:18:06 GMT 5
Who knows, before we’ve seen the programme we cannot definitely say whether there will be something like the WWM evolution sequences in it, although it is not very likely. I am curious to see how they are going to tie the differens segments in each episode together. Somehow from what footage I’ve seen so far, I suspect I’m going to enjoy the paleozoic segments the most. There’s less feathers and hair to content with (which they seem to struggle with a bit). Of course part of that is simply me not being much of an expert on paleozoic animals, hence why I’m probably less critical of their depictions from an accuracy standpoint than I am with, say, mesozoic reptiles. But it’s also a genuinely long and interesting era that’s been sorely underutilized so far, so I think it’s also going to have a lot more novelty and a lot more value in terms of scientific outreach than the 20th documentary portrayal of T. rex and Triceratops, or mammoths and sabre-toothed cats. I guess waiting and watching would be best for both the first thing and all the removed stuff. But - as probably no one is surprised to hear - if my definitive rule out of evolution sequences is erroneous against the odds I will be eating my popcorn twice as fast as any other depiction, no matter how otherwise good it is. I was at first not as excited about the Palaeozoic animals because the initial trailer left me much more confused than excited for what there would be and kind of worried there would not be much (only showing Arthropleura for the Palaeozoic teasing is not exactly what I'd call the ideal preview). The new trailers and the episode reveal change all that - I think I'm with you that I'll enjoy it the most, given how it's a new and apparently thorough take on the ground my favorite palaeodocumentary covered. That said, I am more excited for everything than I would otherwise be. There's something to be said about ONE SHOW - not even a trilogy - that has everything from Cameroceras to Diplodocus to Smilodon, and it gives me the exact same spectacular primordial feeling I get about WWM which is really breathtaking. I also have a notable interest in the Smilodon/terror bird scene (what will they show them doing given knowledge nowadays?), the Sinraptor/Anchiornis (I want more proper Sinraptor screen time after proper PD Sinraptor being a minor character and DR Sinraptors being too whacky to take seriously), the sauropod river scene (so novel to have sauropods swept away by fast flowing water!) and the woolly mammoth/cave lion scene (which looks just plain exciting from the trailer). Infinity Blade , my guess is that if LOOP has the pariesaur get killed, it may be following the principle of demonstrating the formidability of pariesaurs by only having unhealthy ones get killed. I always got that impression from WWM not having the gorgonopsid kill a healthy one so it's one theory I like. But, I will say this: it would be pretty cool to see the pariesaur get away by rolling on the gorgonopsid and stabbing with its spikes or something! Perhaps, and if that's the route they take I will be satisfied. I wouldn't have an inherent problem with the pareiasaur ending up a victim (not any more than I have a problem with Triceratops and Edmontosaurus being brought down by T. rex in both WWD and PhP), but its defenses should be emphasized. The one documentary depiction of predation on pareiasaurs is fine IMO (since the Scutosaurus was already an old exhausted individual). Paleoart is almost universally in favor of the gorgonopsid (typically Inostrancevia), though. |
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Post by Exalt on Oct 11, 2023 6:22:51 GMT 5
Somehow from what footage I’ve seen so far, I suspect I’m going to enjoy the paleozoic segments the most. There’s less feathers and hair to content with (which they seem to struggle with a bit). Of course part of that is simply me not being much of an expert on paleozoic animals, hence why I’m probably less critical of their depictions from an accuracy standpoint than I am with, say, mesozoic reptiles. But it’s also a genuinely long and interesting era that’s been sorely underutilized so far, so I think it’s also going to have a lot more novelty and a lot more value in terms of scientific outreach than the 20th documentary portrayal of T. rex and Triceratops, or mammoths and sabre-toothed cats. I guess my problem is, there has yet to be a really good doc with those latter two. (I like the latter two walking with beasts episodes, but Saber Tooth especially has accuracy problems, and I don't think that anybody thinks that Smilodon looked like that, and prides seem...unlikely, even if the only living social cat does that.) Even with the mammoth fur looking too nice, these are the best-looking versions of the two that I have seen. |
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Post by Exalt on Oct 11, 2023 6:28:48 GMT 5
Who knows, before we’ve seen the programme we cannot definitely say whether there will be something like the WWM evolution sequences in it, although it is not very likely. I am curious to see how they are going to tie the differens segments in each episode together. Somehow from what footage I’ve seen so far, I suspect I’m going to enjoy the paleozoic segments the most. There’s less feathers and hair to content with (which they seem to struggle with a bit). Of course part of that is simply me not being much of an expert on paleozoic animals, hence why I’m probably less critical of their depictions from an accuracy standpoint than I am with, say, mesozoic reptiles. But it’s also a genuinely long and interesting era that’s been sorely underutilized so far, so I think it’s also going to have a lot more novelty and a lot more value in terms of scientific outreach than the 20th documentary portrayal of T. rex and Triceratops, or mammoths and sabre-toothed cats. I was at first not as excited about the Palaeozoic animals because the initial trailer left me much more confused than excited for what there would be and kind of worried there would not be much (only showing Arthropleura for the Palaeozoic teasing is not exactly what I'd call the ideal preview). The new trailers and the episode reveal change all that - I think I'm with you that I'll enjoy it the most, given how it's a new and apparently thorough take on the ground my favorite palaeodocumentary covered. I also have a notable interest in the Smilodon/terror bird scene (what will they show them doing given knowledge nowadays?), the Sinraptor/Anchiornis (I want more proper Sinraptor screen time after proper PD Sinraptor being a minor character and DR Sinraptors being too whacky to take seriously), the sauropod river scene (so novel to have sauropods swept away by fast flowing water!) and the woolly mammoth/cave lion scene (which looks just plain exciting from the trailer). Not to "well, actually" you, but that trailer also had Dunkleosteus and I think maybe Cameroceras.
I am hopeful that the smaller-looking Smilodon in that scene means that they're only showing S.gracillis there, and maybe jumping to see the larger one (presumably S.populator, given the Doedicurus, but I could be wrong), ie, that could be the transition between the terrorbird segment and stuff about Smilodon.
That scene does look tense. I feel like the lions don't know what's good for them, but maybe they have a plan. I could easily see a young mammoth getting Child Immortality.
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Post by dinosauria101 on Oct 11, 2023 17:48:09 GMT 5
I was at first not as excited about the Palaeozoic animals because the initial trailer left me much more confused than excited for what there would be and kind of worried there would not be much (only showing Arthropleura for the Palaeozoic teasing is not exactly what I'd call the ideal preview). The new trailers and the episode reveal change all that - I think I'm with you that I'll enjoy it the most, given how it's a new and apparently thorough take on the ground my favorite palaeodocumentary covered. I also have a notable interest in the Smilodon/terror bird scene (what will they show them doing given knowledge nowadays?), the Sinraptor/Anchiornis (I want more proper Sinraptor screen time after proper PD Sinraptor being a minor character and DR Sinraptors being too whacky to take seriously), the sauropod river scene (so novel to have sauropods swept away by fast flowing water!) and the woolly mammoth/cave lion scene (which looks just plain exciting from the trailer). Not to "well, actually" you, but that trailer also had Dunkleosteus and I think maybe Cameroceras.
I am hopeful that the smaller-looking Smilodon in that scene means that they're only showing S.gracillis there, and maybe jumping to see the larger one (presumably S.populator, given the Doedicurus, but I could be wrong), ie, that could be the transition between the terrorbird segment and stuff about Smilodon.
That scene does look tense. I feel like the lions don't know what's good for them, but maybe they have a plan. I could easily see a young mammoth getting Child Immortality.
Just selected the earliest animal I knew, I'm not 100% confident on the times of those 2. I always figured the Smilodon must have been the same species but it might actually be neat to see them be different species of a genus. Does not exactly happen in palaeodocumentaries that often (one rare example is WWD's Iguanodons). I was hoping the lions would not be so hopelessly outmatched. Not that I'm rooting for either side, but whichever wins I want a conflict that lasts a little longer than one side winning on the spot. |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Oct 11, 2023 18:11:55 GMT 5
More blind speculation, but I think it might be useful contextually.
I just took a look at WWM and aside from the 5-minute somewhat introductory arc with Anomalocaris and Haikouichthys, all the arcs are within the 10-13 minute range (which I suppose must be my sweet spot for time jumps plus immersion). If LOOP is in any way comparable to WWM in this regard, it's going to be able to fit 5-6 10-13 minute time-jumping arcs per episode....maybe this is my hope for a WWM-like format turning into confirmation bias but it seems likely that it's going to be at least similar to this given the time mishmash of the animals in the trailers.
And only 2 more weeks, as of today, to find out whether that speculation will be correct!
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Post by dinosauria101 on Oct 14, 2023 21:34:37 GMT 5
I always thought the T. rex and Triceratops sfx in the LOOP trailer sounded familiar but couldn't quite place where they were from. Now I think I know: they are the sfx Prehistoric Park was using for Elasmotherium, T. rex, and Triceratops.
At 37:25 in A Mammoth Undertaking, you can hear from the Elasmotherium the same grunts the Triceratops is making as it grazes prior to being attacked.
And at 18:53 in T-Rex Returns, you can hear the same bellow made when the LOOP T. rex attacks the Triceratops - and it's made by none other than a T. rex/Triceratops attack here too.
I really hope these are the actual sounds that make it into the show instead of just placeholders like the terror bird pig squeal (that's my love for Prehistoric Park speaking). However, I'm sure there are at least a few viewers who would complain about it if they do end up using Prehistoric Park sfx.
(Sidenote: In general LOOP has some pretty interesting - for being a formal documentary - choices for their apparent placeholders. Besides the terror bird pig squeal I have seen a lot of Reddit comments that said the T. rex roar at 24 seconds here is literally just the Jurassic Park T. rex roar....which it does sound like.)
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Post by Exalt on Oct 14, 2023 23:33:13 GMT 5
So I went to Barnes and Noble today, and they had the companion book, which I purchased.
Firstly, I can confirm the following: the Smilodon and Titanis are not anachronistic; we will be seeing both S.gracilis and S.populator.
Secondly, and most likely a bigger deal, is that I can name, and post pictures of, hitherto unannounced species, which will be spoiler-tagged, unless we object to me posting them at all.
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Post by zoograph on Oct 15, 2023 0:02:12 GMT 5
There is an interesting piece of information from Paleozoologist Briton's tweet which says that there will be 65 species in the show, which is insane honestly (and I'm not sure if these include live-action).
Also hatchlings seem to be Plateosaurus ones, which is interesting. I hope they will have bigger role than in WWD and that they'll actually be featured in Germany this time.
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Post by theropod on Oct 15, 2023 1:59:36 GMT 5
There is an interesting piece of information from Paleozoologist Briton's tweet which says that there will be 65 species in the show, which is insane honestly (and I'm not sure if these include live-action). Also hatchlings seem to be Plateosaurus ones, which is interesting. I hope they will have bigger role than in WWD and that they'll actually be featured in Germany this time. The ones at 0:32 here→? Ok I’m psyched now. Although I really hope they are gonna show a Plateosaurus juvenile too, not just hatchlings  I may have a few things to say about their choice to make them quadrupedal though, but since we don’t really have any perinatal individuals to rule it out, that’s forgivable (though I would have found bipedal hatchlings more parsimonious on the basis that there’s no negative allometry in forelimb size, but rather the opposite, nor is there any evidence of posteriorization of the COM during ontogeny in Plateosaurus, unlike basal Massopoda). |
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Post by Exalt on Oct 15, 2023 2:24:56 GMT 5
Species that are either unannounced outside of the companion book, or have but I wasn't aware/we were uncertain of: -Anamalocaris
-Olenoides (trilobite)
-Gonioclymenia (ammonite)
-An Erythrosuchid, if it's named specifically, I will have to dig deeper
-Plateosaurus, as mentioned above, in at least two life stages
-Pterodactylus
-Sinraptor
-Allosaurus fragilis
-unknown Azhdarchid, not seen well
-Maiasaura
-Maiacetus
-Otodus obliquus
-Megacerops
-Theosodon
-Phorusrhacos(yes, we're getting both it and Titanis)
BTW, I can post pictures, but they will not look good via my phone camera.
Update: apparently half of these were known beforehand
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Post by Exalt on Oct 15, 2023 8:42:53 GMT 5
So it turns out that I can get better pictures in my room than in the bookstore.
Password is lifeonourplanet1! EDIT: I can re-do any on request, one of those is looking rough... |
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