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Post by creature386 on Feb 4, 2015 3:02:16 GMT 5
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Post by Vodmeister on Feb 4, 2015 3:04:08 GMT 5
Yeah, I saw that. I feel bad for not knowing about the Nigeria events until someone pointed it out for me. Tells us everything we need to know about the media.
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Post by Life on Feb 5, 2015 0:32:21 GMT 5
Thread moved from Creationism versus Evolutionism section.
Also, a warning to all: religion-bashing is not permitted in this forum. These kind of topics have the tendency to foster hostility among members for each other since people of different faith post here. Therefore, caution is advised.
Critical evaluation of religious beliefs should be carried out with utmost decency.
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Post by theropod on Feb 5, 2015 2:22:09 GMT 5
From what I see there hasn't been the slightest degree of religious bashing, unless posting facts counts as such, in which case it seems more than warranted.
Oldgrizz perhaps did something along those lines, but it has bbeen some time since then, while everybody else seemed to strictly stay on a factual level. Also that debate was rather along the lines of politics and whether people are responsible for what adherents of their religion do, not the beliefs themselves.
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Post by creature386 on Feb 5, 2015 2:22:50 GMT 5
Also, a warning to all: religion-bashing is not permitted in this forum. These kind of topics have the tendency to foster hostility among members for each other since people of different faith post here. Therefore, caution is advised. Critical evaluation of religious beliefs should be carried out with utmost decency. Well, I see little bashing here, pretty much everyone agrees that terrorism has nothing to do with Islam. Or were you maybe only referring to 0ldgrizz? |
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Post by creature386 on Feb 15, 2015 17:05:47 GMT 5
Looks like Kopenhagen becomes the new Paris.
Fun fact: Three Muslims got killed in America (http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/02/students-murdered-university-north-carolina-campus-150211093231033.html ) and nobody gave a f*ck, but the two people killed by a Muslim in Kopenhagen now appear everywhere in the news. Most people in the comments of the article I posted even glorify the murderer!
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stomatopod
Junior Member
Gluttonous Auchenipterid
Posts: 182
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Post by stomatopod on Feb 16, 2015 4:10:15 GMT 5
That killings actually went all over the webs together with statements that they were anti-islamic, which has not been proben yet. In other news, one of the largest carnival parades in Germany was cancelled because of information that there was a planned act of terrorism. And hundreds of graves in a Jewish Graveyard have Bern desecrated in France.
Do not geht me wrong, I have no problem with Muslims and the Islam, but Islamist Apologist crying wolf is ridiculous. The UK has integrated parts of Sharia and their police did not investigated hundreds of cases of rape and abduction because they feared the Backslash of the Muslim Community.
The problem I See is that the Islamic community often is hesistant to call out and distance themselves from extremists and instead are apologetic and point their finger at the evil west.
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Post by creature386 on Feb 16, 2015 20:40:16 GMT 5
That killings actually went all over the webs together with statements that they were anti-islamic, which has not been proben yet. In other news, one of the largest carnival parades in Germany was cancelled because of information that there was a planned act of terrorism. And hundreds of graves in a Jewish Graveyard have Bern desecrated in France. Do not geht me wrong, I have no problem with Muslims and the Islam, but Islamist Apologist crying wolf is ridiculous. The UK has integrated parts of Sharia and their police did not investigated hundreds of cases of rape and abduction because they feared the Backslash of the Muslim Community. The problem I See is that the Islamic community often is hesistant to call out and distance themselves from extremists and instead are apologetic and point their finger at the evil west. While I agree that the west bashing becomes tedious (particularly the evil America), I think the Muslims did enough to distance themselves from terrorism. After all, many of them are also victims of that, as I wrote before. Its just I can understand them that they feel annoyed because of their (often negative) omnipresence in the media. I would like evidence for the claims about Britain though.Sure, but I never claimed that we should or could erase racism. In some European countries, blacks are not much of a topic, but Muslims are (here the religion and not their race is the problem). That doesn't mean I find the society of certain European countries better than that of America. I think militant religiosity is more of a symptom than the disease itself. People who hate others for their religion don't have a vastly different mentality from those who hate others for their race. |
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drone
Junior Member Rank 1
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Post by drone on Nov 16, 2015 11:29:25 GMT 5
Attacks against non Muslim civilians and anti Semitism are done in full accordance to the Quran and attacks against non Christians are fully sanctioned by the Bible. It's very illogical that many Muslims will denounce ISIL as "not Islamic" and many Christians calling the IRA/LRA as "not true Christians".
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Post by creature386 on Nov 16, 2015 20:18:25 GMT 5
I unfortunately have to agree. What you described is first of all a dictionary example of the No True Scotsman fallacy. One realizes the fallacy when looking at the fact that the fundamentalists themselves think exactly the same of their more moderate counterparts. Another problem is that Christians/Muslims usually present few actual arguments against the fundamentalist interpretation of scripture. I usually see three types of arguments: 1. Common sense tells that these people are wrong. My religion is lovely and peaceful, these people are criminals (obviously a mere appeal to emotion). 2. This verse shows that killing is not OK (good point at the first glance, but the verses are often quote-mined and the opposition can easily find verses that support killing). 3. I have been told something different (and so have fundies). What is necessary is a method to identify which verses should be taken seriously and which not. The historical-critical method of the Catholics is an example. I don't know so much about it (and I question its reliability, as I have seen it a few times in action and it did not actually give objective results), so I cannot comment any further, but I would say it is at least a step in the right direction. Some may say now that talking to fundamentalists is futile (and most religious people seem to think exactly that), so this is a waste of efforts. I agree that fundamentalist leaders/preachers cannot be convinced. They completely ignore the fact that they are not perfect representatives of their religion anyway and simply sum up all their opponents as "atheists" (which tells a lot about how well they can listen). This quote from Conservapedia is a lovely demonstration of that: www.conservapedia.com/Counterexamples_to_an_Old_EarthTranslation: Whoever believes in an old Earth is an atheist. Getting back to my initial point, I still find rebuttals to fundamentalist ideas sensible, as the ones that commit violence are usually young people who were brainwashed by their propaganda ministers and usually not that stubborn, so I think at least them should be convinced. And after all, they are the ones that matter, because all these fundamentalist ministers would be so irrelevant if nobody listened to them:  |
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blaze
Paleo-artist 
Posts: 766
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Post by blaze on Nov 17, 2015 4:19:40 GMT 5
Cherry-picking only goes so far, fundamentalism will never end until people stop treating books riddled with bronze age morality as holy, someone, somewhere, will easily use the always ignored (by moderates) but ever present hatred and bigotry contained in them to inspire extremists. The only solution would be a complete reform, a removal of those passages in the scriptures, but such a change would never sit well with even the most moderate adherents despite they already treating them as if they weren't there (by either being ignorant of their existence, chalking them up as products of their time or metaphors).
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Post by An Goldish Jade on Mar 12, 2016 10:54:27 GMT 5
Of course, right now, United states admits by saying "some" of them are radical, but as long as what they do could make USA happy, then we will keeping on hearing them been called "freedom fighters" by USA.
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Post by Life on Mar 15, 2016 13:48:25 GMT 5
Cherry-picking only goes so far, fundamentalism will never end until people stop treating books riddled with bronze age morality as holy, someone, somewhere, will easily use the always ignored (by moderates) but ever present hatred and bigotry contained in them to inspire extremists. The only solution would be a complete reform, a removal of those passages in the scriptures, but such a change would never sit well with even the most moderate adherents despite they already treating them as if they weren't there (by either being ignorant of their existence, chalking them up as products of their time or metaphors). Fundamentalism have less to do with faith and is more about mindset. You might have heard the term Atheist fundamentalist in current times? Yes, they do exist: I do think society would benefit from the erasure of religion. I’d go beyond that and become more fundie: not only religion, the whole cultures (western and eastern) that gave birth to these religions should be erased and a new culture based on human rights should arise before we can begin to talk about a truly secular and free society.
So yes, this is me.Source: www.patheos.com/blogs/marginoferr/2014/12/23/ok-im-an-atheist-fundamentalist-now-what/You see, the Atheist fundamentalists desire nothing short of elimination of religion(s) and want to reshape the society in their image and beliefs. So how is this mindset productive? Do you think that this development will eliminate all EVIL from the world at large? --- Moreover, you might not be aware but I shall point out that a large number of 'terrorists' had secular education and were not good Muslims/believers. I can provide many examples, if you are interested. However, secular media sources tend to mislead people regarding this matter; their 'agenda' is to blame religion(s) for all EVIL in the world at large. |
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blaze
Paleo-artist
Posts: 766
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Post by blaze on Mar 15, 2016 21:53:36 GMT 5
But you can't become a fundamentalist unless you have strong faith and beliefs first. Those "atheist fundamentalists", their desire to get rid of religion is not born out of them being atheists, but of their believe that religion is ultimately evil and holds us back and the way they go on about fixing that problem indicates that they are not using logic and reason. It happens, to become an atheist does not necessarily make one an skeptic or logically minded, a lot of people just change an ideology for another.
Likewise a secular education does not make one an skeptic and logically minded, we have secular education in my country and we are still like 80-90% Christian, why? basic education is not enough to make most people think deeply about the beliefs hammered to their skulls when they were children.
I'm not sure that secular media has that agenda, at least in the world at large, secular media in the UK and other European countries (and government authorities too for that matter) seem hell bent on hiding the wrong doings of radical muslims within their borders, as if fear of being called racist was stronger than anything else.
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Post by spartan on Mar 16, 2016 4:33:17 GMT 5
The big difference is that atheists don't have a holy book where an allegedly infallible being tells them what to do and what not to do.
Atheists have nothing in common except not believing in something.
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