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Post by creature386 on Dec 29, 2019 18:48:20 GMT 5
Yikes, that's almost adorably ignorant. No, really. Mountainlord is giving lots of debate, posting, and info for this thread which we wouldn't have had otherwise. I do not necesarily favor the tiger but this is by no means a bad thing to have them posted. He brings up points worth of discussion, but his aggressive posting style might alienate some people. Then again, I don't participate as much in this thread as others do. I'm divided. |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 29, 2019 19:59:47 GMT 5
I mean, all that info enlightens people and helps form debate. I think it makes up for any aggressive posting.
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Post by kekistani on Dec 30, 2019 3:11:11 GMT 5
I mean, all that info enlightens people and helps form debate. I think it makes up for any aggressive posting. No, it really doesn't. |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 30, 2019 4:13:25 GMT 5
I mean, all that info enlightens people and helps form debate. I think it makes up for any aggressive posting. No, it really doesn't. It does. Just look at how many pages this thread had before and how many it has now! |
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Post by kekistani on Dec 30, 2019 7:41:29 GMT 5
It does. Just look at how many pages this thread had before and how many it has now! Quality>Quantity. Being an ass who may be right (or may not be) does not excuse being an ass. |
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Post by Ceratodromeus on Dec 30, 2019 8:24:50 GMT 5
Ceratodromeous
And thank you for proving my point that your just a little clueless boy, that doesn't know shit about this topic. So what do we get then, two posts of no substance to this thread, just more trolling bullshit. Typical. lmao, How many forums and servers have you been yeeted from with your cancerous borderline obsessive behavior again? i don't think copy pasting is really useful. In fact, i would count on the fact you don't understand most of what you post. |
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Post by Ceratodromeus on Dec 30, 2019 8:26:58 GMT 5
It does. Just look at how many pages this thread had before and how many it has now! Mate i think you argue just to argue and you're still just about wrong every time you do it. This. Copy pasting screenshots and intermittent screeching at another fanboy doesn't make quality. Something mountainlord won't ever comprehend. |
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Post by Infinity Blade on Dec 30, 2019 9:56:41 GMT 5
Are you talking about the forum in general or just this topic specifically? If the former, Ceratodromeus has most definitely "posted TONS of info and informative accounts that people on this forum can learn from" in the past.
Just a reminder for this thread: keep name-calling to a minimum.
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Post by Ceratodromeus on Dec 30, 2019 10:38:23 GMT 5
Yes, posting screenshots other people have posted for like a decade on these forums and screeching unintelligibly is quality content. Good lord.
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Post by Ceratodromeus on Dec 30, 2019 10:39:50 GMT 5
Just a reminder for this thread: keep name-calling to a minimum. Boo on you sir. |
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Post by Infinity Blade on Dec 30, 2019 10:46:35 GMT 5
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Post by brobear on Dec 30, 2019 14:49:42 GMT 5
Quote from MountainLord: And last time I checked, according to Russian biologists like Matjushkyn, the Brown bear almost always gets displaced from its kill by the tiger. The way nature works.
People, including biologists give their opinions. Fact is, no one is there to witness what happens at a kill site. The best that a biologist can do is try to read the footprints and other vague signs left behind.
From watching sloth bear/leopard and black bear/cougar interactions, we can observe big cat/bear relations. The size ratio between the sloth bear and the leopard and the size ratio between the black bear and the cougar match with the size ration between the tiger and the Ussuri brown bear.
A leopard will relinquish his kill to a leopard without a fight. Same with cougar and black bear. No physical contact. So, if the tiger is unwilling to stand his ground and fight with the grizzly, there are no clues left behind that the tiger was displaced. We have no reason to believe that the tiger would act differently from other cat species. Besides, a tiger is unwilling to fight even a sloth bear face-to-face smaller than himself.
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Post by elosha11 on Dec 30, 2019 17:05:03 GMT 5
Quote from MountainLord: And last time I checked, according to Russian biologists like Matjushkyn, the Brown bear almost always gets displaced from its kill by the tiger. The way nature works. People, including biologists give their opinions. Fact is, no one is there to witness what happens at a kill site. The best that a biologist can do is try to read the footprints and other vague signs left behind. From watching sloth bear/leopard and black bear/cougar interactions, we can observe big cat/bear relations. The size ratio between the sloth bear and the leopard and the size ratio between the black bear and the cougar match with the size ration between the tiger and the Ussuri brown bear. A leopard will relinquish his kill to a leopard without a fight. Same with cougar and black bear. No physical contact. So, if the tiger is unwilling to stand his ground and fight with the grizzly, there are no clues left behind that the tiger was displaced. We have no reason to believe that the tiger would act differently from other cat species. Besides, a tiger is unwilling to fight even a sloth bear face-to-face smaller than himself. , you are entitled to your opinion, and I think this is contest is certainly disputable on both sides, but I'd ask you to post more specific evidence if you have it -- because mountainlord has posted a mountain of it (pun intended). You might dispute the veracity of his sources, but he's certainly posted a large number of accounts and some video evidence suggesting the Amur tiger is a formidable and deadly opponent even for large male bears. Do you have specific accounts going the other way? And if you already posted it on the thread, just reference the page, as I can't claim I've read every single page of this thread, although I've read a lot of it. As to claiming a tiger is unwilling to fight even a small sloth bear face to face, don't you find that at least disingenuous? We've all seen the accounts. Several posted show tigers killing and consuming sloth bears. One shows what appears to be a young tiger backing off from a confrontation with a sloth bear. Another shows a sloth bear running away from a tiger. And then one shows a prolonged fight between a (female?) sloth bear and a tiger (tigress?), in which the tiger clearly dominates and injures the bear. To the bear's credit, it keeps fighting hard and may have tired out the tiger, who then retreats and goes into water to cool off, tired but uninjured. Sloth bears are tough and aggressive animals, and I don't think tigers think of them as readily preferred prey, but to claim tigers won't even face them?? C'mon, no one believes that.  |
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Post by elosha11 on Dec 30, 2019 17:14:20 GMT 5
Agree wholeheartedly with this. I'm concerned to see the level of ad hominem and attacks and insults rising in several threads. A more constructive and educative way to debate anyone is to be firm but respectful. Claiming one's arguments are misplaced or even misguided, is far better than saying they are an idiot, troll, or stupid, or whatever pejorative you may come up with. WoA was founded by longtime members who expressly wanted to avoid the juvenile antics found on other AVA forums. Let's not let our commentary appeal to the lowest common denominator. Quality of posts (and posters) is more important than quantity. I strongly encourage all of us to show the same level of respect and maturity toward others that would you would want shown to you. |
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Post by brobear on Dec 30, 2019 17:34:44 GMT 5
elosha11 sloth bears are hunted and killed by tigers by ambush. If a sloth bear runs, the tiger will chase. Show me a video of a tiger going face-to-face with any bear is the wild. A leopard will not face a sloth bear. The size ratio between leopard and sloth bear is like between tiger and grizzly The same can be said of black bear and cougar. American black bears frequently displace cougars from their kills. Instead of I should prove that a Russian black grizzly can and will displace a tiger of any age, sex, or size from a carcass, others should instead prove that a tiger acts differently from other cat species. One December morning a few years ago, I witnessed the unusual sight of a sloth bear feeding on a buffalo calf. shaggygod.proboards.com/I came upon a fresh leopard kill about 5 metres off the Talgasmankade road in Yala National Park. The leopard had obviously been disturbed by our approach and had not consumed any part of the kill; it had, however, made an incision about 10 cm wide in the skin of the stomach. As the leopard was not in evidence, we left the area, but returned at around 2.30 that same afternoon. We spotted the leopard, a young male, on a tamarind tree about 50 metres into the jungle. I parked the jeep about 30 metres from the kill, and whiled away the time taking photographs of the leopard on the tree. Suddenly, I heard rustling sound coming from behind the jeep. A sloth bear was approaching the kill, downwind, and therefore oblivious of my presence. The leopard, seeing the bear, slipped down the tree and went towards the dead calf, obviously anxious to protect its spoils. The bear took no notice of him, but kept sniffing the air and following the drag-mark made by the leopard earlier on, which meant he was not taking the most direct path to kill. The leopard sped towards the bear, belly to the ground, making low snarling, hissing sounds. The bear did not relent however, even as the big cat sprang at him thus three more times. Outdone, and in no mood for a fight, the leopard retreated to a small hollow in the thorny scrub. The bear did not bother to pursue him. The confrontation had been a noisy one, but with absolutely no physical contact. The bear then opened up the calf's stomach and began sucking on the gory juices. Then, using his paw, he tore out the intestines and ate them. Next, while holding down the carcass with one paw, he opened out the young buffalo's chest with a single sweep of the other paw and fed on the heart and lungs, sucking up all the blood in the cavity. It was interesting to note that he did not eat any of the 'flesh' (muscle). After feeding for about an hour and a half, the bear sat down patiently, cleaned his paws and face, rolled on the sandy road, and then ambled off in the same direction from whence he had come. Some minutes after his departure, the leopard came out of the thicket and started feeding. We left him to his meal. www.lankalibrary.com/wlife/slothbear.htm |
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