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Post by creature386 on Dec 30, 2019 17:35:19 GMT 5
I second (third?) what elosha and Infinity Blade said. I'd even argue that sufficiently annoying everyone else can be a (temporal) ban reason, as letting such people run free limits our pool of members in the long term. Mountainlord already had a temporal ban once (not sure if it was a day or a week). He gets another week if he fails to tone down his aggressive posting style.
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 30, 2019 17:45:31 GMT 5
It does. Just look at how many pages this thread had before and how many it has now! Quality>Quantity. Being an ass who may be right (or may not be) does not excuse being an ass. I mean yeah, a bunch of the flaming was bad. I'm at least referring to the more placid sections. |
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mountainlord
Member
Tiger - The Legendary Killer of Brown bears
Posts: 309
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Post by mountainlord on Dec 30, 2019 19:42:31 GMT 5
Ceratodromeous
And thank you for proving my point that your just a little clueless boy, that doesn't know shit about this topic. So what do we get then, two posts of no substance to this thread, just more trolling bullshit. Typical. lmao, How many forums and servers have you been yeeted from with your cancerous borderline obsessive behavior again? i don't think copy pasting is really useful. In fact, i would count on the fact you don't understand most of what you post.
And like I said before, you haven't contributed nothing, absolutely nothing to this topic. So I don't know why your running your mouth for. Your trolling. |
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mountainlord
Member
Tiger - The Legendary Killer of Brown bears
Posts: 309
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Post by mountainlord on Dec 30, 2019 19:44:44 GMT 5
I second (third?) what elosha and Infinity Blade said. I'd even argue that sufficiently annoying everyone else can be a (temporal) ban reason, as letting such people run free limits our pool of members in the long term. Mountainlord already had a temporal ban once (not sure if it was a day or a week). He gets another week if he fails to tone down his aggressive posting style. |
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mountainlord
Member
Tiger - The Legendary Killer of Brown bears
Posts: 309
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Post by mountainlord on Dec 30, 2019 19:46:10 GMT 5
And Brobear, I'm gonna address your post later. Your very, very dishonest.
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Post by Infinity Blade on Dec 30, 2019 19:55:55 GMT 5
Except we did. Not just to him really, but to everyone in general.
Life said this:
While I said this:
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Post by creature386 on Dec 30, 2019 20:06:27 GMT 5
I second (third?) what elosha and Infinity Blade said. I'd even argue that sufficiently annoying everyone else can be a (temporal) ban reason, as letting such people run free limits our pool of members in the long term. Mountainlord already had a temporal ban once (not sure if it was a day or a week). He gets another week if he fails to tone down his aggressive posting style. Cerato has already received a warning from Infinity Blade. I was focusing on your because your type of behavior has been going on for a far longer time. Plus, we have a system under which people who have already received a punishment tend to get gradually harder ones. That being said, Cerato's "shitmountainlord" post has been reported to the administration which is not a good sign. I'm not yet sure what measures to take that don't look like I'm unfairly picking on people. We have received two reported posts from this thread in the last 8 days, how about locking the thread for a week if we get a third one so that you can all calm down? EDIT: It seems the "reporter" has a bit too lax standards, so I'm gonna drop this. |
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Post by brobear on Dec 30, 2019 20:11:55 GMT 5
And Brobear, I'm gonna address your post later. Your very, very dishonest.  |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 30, 2019 21:02:52 GMT 5
A week seems like a bit much to me, but I think if any more posts from here are reported we can lock for a day or 2 and eyeball it from there
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mountainlord
Member
Tiger - The Legendary Killer of Brown bears
Posts: 309
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Post by mountainlord on Dec 30, 2019 21:15:56 GMT 5
And Brobear, I'm gonna address your post later. Your very, very dishonest.
Even elosha has acknowledged the fact that I've shown you more than enough evidence to easily prove that the tiger is a very formidable and deadly foe for a large male Brown bear. Yet you still can't accept the irrefutable evidence that I've posted.
Every single claim I've made about tigers vs Brown bears, I've posted nothing but credible evidence from Russian biologists/undisputed authorities that proves all of my claims. Whereas you just clearly make stuff up and never, ever post any proof to back your claims, because you know your blatantly lying.
Matjushkyn is a undisputed authority regarding tigers and bears. He tracked tigers for several winters, and his own personal observations show that the Brown bear almost always surrenders its kill to the tiger, period. There's no disputing this. Even the tracks in the snow clearly showed that this happened.
Biologists Maurice Hornocker and Peter Matthiessen, who have also studied tigers in the Russian far east, clearly stated that the Brown bear prefers to contest the much smaller FEMALE tiger, lest it become an item of tiger diet. Despite all this clear-cut evidence I've shown you, you still continue to deny the truth of the tigers blatant dominance against the Brown bear over kill-disputes.
On top of all of this - I've even posted numerous fight statistics from Russian experts that also confirm that the tiger usually defeats and kills the Brown bear over kill-disputes. But that still wasn't enough for you.
You make ALOT of wild claims, but never back it up with any shred of proof. Completely opposite to me. How do expect anyone to take you seriously in this debate, when you never post any evidence that supports your claims. You just lie and lie and lie and lie some more. Post the evidence if you wanna be taken seriously.
You claimed that a male tiger will never accept the challenge from a mature male Grizzly and the bear will displace him, yet you haven't posted a single case where a male Brown bear even dared to challenge an adult male tiger, let alone displace him. This is completely made-up lies by you. The facts, reality and clear-cut evidence shows you that the mature male Brown bear strictly avoids - In some cases even fears adult male tigers. - Unlike you, I have posted the clear evidence confirming this.
The well known proven facts are - that the tiger overall dominates both Sloth bears, Black bears and Brown bears, and in every single fight to the death recorded throughout history between tigers and sloth bears/black bears, the bears were killed and devoured every single time. There's even videos of juvenile tigers dominating and scaring away adult male sloth bears, easily. This is a complete mismatch. The tiger is far superior.
And accounts from undisputed Russian authorities, biologists, naturalists, hunters etc etc....have clearly shown that the tiger is the GENERAL WINNER in a fight against a Brown bear, and that Brown bears are even dominated in kill-disputes by tigers, and will almost always surrender their kills to tigers. - I HAVE PROVEN ALL OF THIS WITH HARD EVIDENCE FROM EXPERTS.
You on the other hand, just make stuff up, blatantly lie and NEVER post any shred of proof that backs up your wild claims.
I'm sorry Brobear, but the reality is, that the Amur tiger is far more dominant over the Brown bear, is the general winner in face-to-face fights even over kill-disputes and that in general, bears are AFRAID of tigers, as stated by the Russian biologists. (Heptner/Sludskii).
Remember, there's a very good reason why the Russians widely regard and acknowledge the tiger - not the Brown bear - but the tiger to be the undisputed lord and master of the taiga.
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Post by elosha11 on Dec 30, 2019 21:21:17 GMT 5
elosha11 sloth bears are hunted and killed by tigers by ambush. If a sloth bear runs, the tiger will chase. Show me a video of a tiger going face-to-face with any bear is the wild. A leopard will not face a sloth bear. The size ratio between leopard and sloth bear is like between tiger and grizzly The same can be said of black bear and cougar. American black bears frequently displace cougars from their kills. Instead of I should prove that a Russian black grizzly can and will displace a tiger of any age, sex, or size from a carcass, others should instead prove that a tiger acts differently from other cat species. One December morning a few years ago, I witnessed the unusual sight of a sloth bear feeding on a buffalo calf. shaggygod.proboards.com/I came upon a fresh leopard kill about 5 metres off the Talgasmankade road in Yala National Park. The leopard had obviously been disturbed by our approach and had not consumed any part of the kill; it had, however, made an incision about 10 cm wide in the skin of the stomach. As the leopard was not in evidence, we left the area, but returned at around 2.30 that same afternoon. We spotted the leopard, a young male, on a tamarind tree about 50 metres into the jungle. I parked the jeep about 30 metres from the kill, and whiled away the time taking photographs of the leopard on the tree. Suddenly, I heard rustling sound coming from behind the jeep. A sloth bear was approaching the kill, downwind, and therefore oblivious of my presence. The leopard, seeing the bear, slipped down the tree and went towards the dead calf, obviously anxious to protect its spoils. The bear took no notice of him, but kept sniffing the air and following the drag-mark made by the leopard earlier on, which meant he was not taking the most direct path to kill. The leopard sped towards the bear, belly to the ground, making low snarling, hissing sounds. The bear did not relent however, even as the big cat sprang at him thus three more times. Outdone, and in no mood for a fight, the leopard retreated to a small hollow in the thorny scrub. The bear did not bother to pursue him. The confrontation had been a noisy one, but with absolutely no physical contact. The bear then opened up the calf's stomach and began sucking on the gory juices. Then, using his paw, he tore out the intestines and ate them. Next, while holding down the carcass with one paw, he opened out the young buffalo's chest with a single sweep of the other paw and fed on the heart and lungs, sucking up all the blood in the cavity. It was interesting to note that he did not eat any of the 'flesh' (muscle). After feeding for about an hour and a half, the bear sat down patiently, cleaned his paws and face, rolled on the sandy road, and then ambled off in the same direction from whence he had come. Some minutes after his departure, the leopard came out of the thicket and started feeding. We left him to his meal. www.lankalibrary.com/wlife/slothbear.htmbrobear, but again, I'm wondering if you have any specific accounts/videos of brown bears killing tigers. I know bears killing tigers have been occasionally reported in various literature and one or two accounts mountainlord posted mention bears killing tigers. Still, he's provided numerous accounts of reported tigers preying on brown bears, including even adult male bears. I'm just wondering if there are specific accounts going the other way. You did mention in your post above that you have numerous references to bears driving away tigers from kills. Have you posted such accounts, and if so, can you direct me to them? As to your comments about sloth bears, I find your perspective somewhat problematic. You claim that tigers won't "face" sloth bears except by ambush, but your cited proof of this is claiming that when sloth bears flee from tigers, the tigers can then kill them from behind. Do you not see the flaw in this logic? It's the bear fleeing and being killed, not the tiger. If sloth bears generally think they can dominate tigers, why are they the ones usually fleeing? And where are the accounts of sloth bears killing tigers? Instead, in almost every serious conflict, we find the tiger or tigress killing or injuring the sloth bear. As to your analogy comparing the size of Amur tiger/brown bears to cougar/black bear or leopard/sloth bear, this seems quite inaccurate. Just recently in this thread, modern weights of the tigers and bears were reported and on average they were close to identical (unfortunately size of both animals appears to be shrinking with continued human pressure and encroachment). As to the leopard v sloth bear account above, that does show an impressive attitude from the sloth bear. I note that Sri Lanka leopards are quite large, generally as larger as South African ones, but the account does note it was a young male leopard, which might indicate it wasn't yet full grown/experienced. That said, I would agree that a sloth bear would very formidable for any leopard. I'm just not convinced the analogy can be taken so far as to predict Amur tiger/brown bear conflicts. |
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Post by brobear on Dec 30, 2019 22:39:20 GMT 5
Very few accounts as a tiger will not choose a mature male grizzly as potential prey and neither is he likely to accept a challenge from a mature male grizzly in defense of a carcass.  |
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Post by brobear on Dec 30, 2019 22:40:26 GMT 5
Bear kills tiger:  |
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Post by brobear on Dec 30, 2019 22:41:18 GMT 5
books.google.com/books?id=5hS-vzTHU5oC&pg=PA62&dq=Bear+kills+tigers+north+american+predators&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiX5-v1-8zfAhWurVkKHbGWCCQQ6AEIJTAA  |
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