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Post by elosha11 on Nov 30, 2019 0:41:18 GMT 5
7.17 m vs 6.17 m corresponding to a 50% in weight increase isn’t generous, it is less than isometry (which would be (7.17/6.17)³=57%). Scaling from Lolong, a real 7 m crocodile would.be 46-51% heavier, i.e. about 1.57 -1.63 t depending on the exact methodology of the length measurement. There is as little basis for making it heavier (what dinosauria seems to be suggesting) as there is for making it lighter (as elosha seems to be suggesting). Or at least, nothing has been posted, if you want to establish allometry you should have the data to demonstrate it exists. I think I actually posted a paper on length-mass relationships in saltwater crocodiles somewhere, you could look at that. But there’s no actual evidence for any 7m+ crocodiles anyway, is there? Lolong is the biggest saltie reliably measured. Thanks theropod. Ok, based on this, my original 1.5 increase from Lolong's weight/length, and adding one meter to 7.17 is fairly accurate. A seven meter (as opposed to 7.17 meter) sw croc could be predicted to weigh around 3550 pounds, and a 7.17 maybe close to two tons. So I guess I was a bit wrong, as was dinosauria101. However -- and this is a big however -- there's really nothing other than speculation for 7+ meter sw crocs, much less any weighing of them. What we're left with in reality is a gigantic croc is typically around a ton, and a gigantic GWS is around 2 to 2.5 tons. A massive size disparity at roughly equal lengths. |
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Post by dinosauria101 on Nov 30, 2019 3:33:35 GMT 5
Well then yes, at max, it's a mismatch.
But on average it's reasonably close, I suppose, with a 700 kg croc and 1 tonne shark
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Post by elosha11 on Dec 5, 2019 20:36:59 GMT 5
A 700 kg croc is not "average" it's well above average weight. The "average" saltie male is not over 1500 pounds. If you want to use that weight, it It would be equivalent to a 3000 pound shark, a large shark but not yet approaching absolute max size.
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 5, 2019 20:57:34 GMT 5
The OP states 409-1000 kg for the average male saltie, of which 700 kg is the mean
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Post by elosha11 on Dec 5, 2019 23:51:48 GMT 5
OP overestimates average male croc's weight range.
From wikipedia, with citation to Guiness Book of Animal Facts and Records:
From National Geographic. I agree with the first sentence, the second sentence about max size individual's weight is accurate, but not the assertion that such animals are not "uncommon."
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500 kgs is far closer to an average weight than 700 kgs. 1000 kgs is really the established max weight, and anything much greater than than is pure unverified speculation.
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 6, 2019 0:41:03 GMT 5
Ah. Then this is indeed a bit onesided - 465 kg vs 1 tonne on average and 1 vs 2.5 tonnes at max.
At parity however, I think it would be a draw. They both have very deadly bites that could turn the fight in their favor with just 1 hit, and the shark does not have to breathe while the croc would be more durable.
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Post by Grey on Dec 18, 2019 23:15:25 GMT 5
What is the current opinion about this ? At times I'm undecided depending the weight difference.
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 18, 2019 23:19:55 GMT 5
GWS easily on average, 50/50 at parity
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2019 22:57:16 GMT 5
At parity, I'm not sure how agile the croc is underwater, because the shark may be able to get the belly quite handily
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 28, 2019 23:25:45 GMT 5
Well, aren't salties pretty good swimmers? They have been found in open water many times
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Post by Ceratodromeus on Dec 29, 2019 8:57:43 GMT 5
Considering the fact that they'r crocodiles i would like to assume they're good at swimming.
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Post by elosha11 on Dec 30, 2019 16:40:20 GMT 5
SW crocs are obviously good swimmers. Still, in relatively deep ocean water, where this encounter would almost necessarily take place, the shark would be in its more natural environment and would likely have the attendant advantages.
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Post by brobear on Dec 30, 2019 19:22:09 GMT 5
Just in case it isn't buried here someplace, over in "Carnivora" blog site, on this same topic, there is posted a study showing that a salt water crocodile off the coast of Australia will chase off large sharks including even the biggest great whites.
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Post by dinosauria101 on Dec 30, 2019 19:34:33 GMT 5
^Not a surprise; even if they would win in a death fight, no GWS wants to engage a saltie as the risk of injury is too much
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Post by elosha11 on Dec 30, 2019 23:52:27 GMT 5
Just in case it isn't buried here someplace, over in "Carnivora" blog site, on this same topic, there is posted a study showing that a salt water crocodile off the coast of Australia will chase off large sharks including even the biggest great whites. Highly skeptical of that. Tell me where to find it on carnivora. I have never in my life seen such an study. The only reported interactions between crocs and GWS of which I am aware is of GWS preying on American crocs off Costa Rica in the past. There is a laughably fake account of a SW croc supposedly killing a GWS in Australia. Perhaps that's what you're referring to? I and others have debunked that anecdote and fake picture earlier in this thread. There were some carnivora posters on the GWS v croc thread that were trying to pass that off as true, but it's clearly fake. |
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