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Post by creature386 on Aug 31, 2014 14:47:17 GMT 5
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Post by Supercommunist on Aug 31, 2014 15:25:59 GMT 5
The death penalty is more expensive than a life sentence, is barely, if at all more effective, and often instills a "nothing to lose" attitude within prisoners, which often makes them behave more violently and is more likely to motivate them into making serious escape attempts. The only time I think it should be considered is if the prisoner themselves saw it as the preffered alternative.
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Post by creature386 on Sept 2, 2014 17:14:26 GMT 5
If Vodmeister opened this thread, we'd already have two pages, what do I always do wrong?
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Post by theropod on Sept 3, 2014 1:34:36 GMT 5
I don’t think the death penalty makes a lot of sense. Supercommunist already gave some very good reasons. It’s nothing but an outdated concept that comes from a time when the concept of rehabilitation was not a major consideration. But I think nowadays everyone should be given this chance if they want it. Of course this comes at a certain security risk, but that’s probably offset by the aforementioned "nothing to lose attitude". So in the end, it has no real advantages (maybe it used to though), besides being a power display of the state ("We have the right to take people’s lifes!!!!!"). However, I do believe that people who feel they cannot live with what they have done should be given the option to die. |
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Fragillimus335
Member
Sauropod fanatic, and dinosaur specialist
Posts: 573
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Post by Fragillimus335 on Sept 3, 2014 1:38:18 GMT 5
I say a life of hard labor with the proceeds going to paying off their debts to the families they effected should be offered as an alternative to the death penalty.
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Post by creature386 on Sept 3, 2014 2:05:10 GMT 5
(changed the title, since nobody seems to prefer the alternative name)
From my own experience, most of the pro death penalty community thinks simple incarceration is nothing a criminal truly fears. I believe these guys have no idea what they are talking about. The discouraging effect of death penalty is simply a myth, there is plenty of evidence for this.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2014 12:48:29 GMT 5
I think that the death penalty should only be reserved for the worst of the worst(such as terrorist leaders)
If someone does something similar to the the 9/11 bombings(which killed 3000+ people), for example, he/she would be eligible for the death penalty imo.
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Post by theropod on Sept 3, 2014 14:43:16 GMT 5
You don’t need the death penalty for that, the US military would take care of it either way…
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Post by creature386 on Sept 3, 2014 20:15:02 GMT 5
Military leaders are hard to capture, but if they get captured, even I am for executing them. The thing is that judges tend to be overemotional on this topic. Many people who are merely accused to be terrorists get sent to Guantanamo and get among the worst possible torture one can imagine.
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Post by Vodmeister on Sept 4, 2014 12:40:55 GMT 5
In my view, the death penalty should only be used for the worst of the worst.
Even murderers and rapists, despite the horrible crimes they committed, ultimately deserve another chance if they can revive themselves.
To turn a criminal into a civilized citizen should be the #1 goal IMO.
Of course, some sociopaths are lost causes and cannot be fixed.
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Post by malikc6 on Sept 4, 2014 13:02:46 GMT 5
I am all for the death penalty. In fact I wish it would happen sooner instead of taking years to do so. I do think that it is reserved for certain evil people and that their case needs to be fully analyzed before they are put to death, because yes there are innocent people that die.
One of the reasons I'm for the death penalty, is because we have too many prisoners as it is. People always say "just have them do life in prison." You know what happens? The prisoners have nothing to lose, and are a threat to other prisoners. There have been criminals doing life that have killed prison guards. Nothing happens to them other than getting more time on their sentence, and since they are already doing life, they can care less. These are also the same people that make life in prison hard for other inmates. Some inmates have changed and want out and want peace, but you got "Big Bubba" who's raping and killing the other inmates for his own pleasure and he has nothing to lose, and the guards can't do too much about it. Same with the prison gangs that terrorize the others that aren't in gangs. These criminals force other inmates to always be on watch and to keep your guard up. Once more, we have a overpopulation problem in prisons. In America, we have the highest incarceration rate in the whole world!
Another reason why I'm for the death penalty, is because we pay taxes to feed these scum. Some homeless people actually purposely cause crime just so they can go to jail/prison and be fed and washed. We are paying money for people who have done horrific crimes. These people are better off dead for the sake of others.
If I were to talk to a anti death penalty person, my question to that guy would be "Why NOT have this guy killed?" If a thug raped and killed three young children and was arrested, why not have him face death? What purpose can he possibly serve? Labor you say? He doesn't have to do it you know. He's already facing life and clearly has nothing to lose, so he is immune to discipline and further danger. Just have him killed. And don't take several years to do it! Fully investigate the case a couple of times and then shoot him in the head, inject poison into his veins, or gas him.
Of course it does depend on the severity of their crime. Not all murderers should be executed. The scenarios and circumstances play a role. However if it were up to me, cold blooded killers would always get the death penalty. Well known dangerous gang members would also be sentenced to die. Hell gangs when put in prison tend to dominate and become more dangerous. The inmates that want no trouble often time try to get solitary confinement or to be seperated from the other inmates. They often can't because its always full. They're forced to deal with rapists, cold blooded murderers, gangs, and psychopaths. In my ROP class, there was a story about a man that was doing two years for assaulting an officer and resisting arrest, and he was just 9 months from being freed. What happened? He got killed by another inmate who was already in prison for multiple murder charges.
Another thing I want to point out, is that gangs from prison can actually make hits on people that aren't in prison. They do this very long process with mail, and they make certain codings. They send it to whoever and instruct them to kill whoever. They also do a process of somehow getting drugs from the outside world into prisons by doing various ways of making sure it gets past the screeners. Yes inmates have actually managed to smuggle drugs from the outside world into their cells. Even alcohol!
People may disagree with me, but to me, if you have done something so utterly horrible and have no remorse for it, your life loses it value and you do not deserve to live on the planet with the rest of us. You are an abysmal human being. You do NOT deserve life. You don't have a conscience or seem to care and respect human life, so why should we respect and care for your pathetic life to live?
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Post by malikc6 on Sept 4, 2014 13:12:43 GMT 5
I also want to say that I think if a person gets life, they also have the death penalty option. They can choose which one they want. This of course is for anyone doing life.
People mention rehabilitation. I'm for that to, but it depends. If they do have a conscience and are sorry, they can be helped. If you are psychotic, just kill them. The true definition of a psychopath is someone who lacks a conscience. They lack empathy for others, and often are very brave up to the point where they don't care if they are caught or killed. They are often fearless. What's scary is that they also tend to be very intelligent and manipulative. They also are good at faking emotions. Another very scary fact is that 1 out of 100 people are psychopaths. All of them are potential criminals, but luckily, not all psychopaths are bad. In fact, being psychotic isn't necessarily a bad thing. Its still not good, but its only bad if the psychopath has evil intentions.
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Post by Venomous Dragon on Sept 4, 2014 13:21:13 GMT 5
I'm a firm believer in that the punishment should fit the crime, if you purposefully take another's life yours should be forfeit. That doesn't necessarily mean that you should be executed but that your life is no longer your own and that what happens with it is no longer for you to decide.
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Post by creature386 on Sept 4, 2014 19:30:24 GMT 5
As for the argument of hopeless cases who continue to be criminals in prison, I am wondering if certain forms of torture should be allowed for such special cases, so you'd have something to intimidate the guys who think they have nothing to lose. It also can be useful to get information of maybe a caught member of a gang (when he is still alive, he can still have some kind of use like that).
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Post by Supercommunist on Sept 5, 2014 0:01:20 GMT 5
Malik, I would like to point out that part of the reason that the US has such a large prison population, is because the majority of prisons are run by private buisnesses, and actually want more.
I'll respond to your other posts when I have more time.
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